mr2-digest Wednesday, 20 August 1997 Volume 01 : Number 1486 Re: MR2 Toyota Dealers are a JOKE RE: MR2 OOPS!! (A wet weather driving adventure in a '93 NA) MR2 TURBO Oil Consuption - 1K/1QT RE: MR2 Toyota Dealers are a JOKE Re: MR2:MK1Extra long wheel studs Re: MR2 OOPS!! (A wet weather driving adventure in a '93 NA) Re: MR2 Toyota Quality Re: MR2 Toyota Dealers are a JOKE Re: MR2 3SGTE - Big HP rebuild Re: BLITZ MR2 Re: dyerjoe: MR2 MK2 T Crack in Exhaust header MR2 MKI POWER WINDOW TOO SLOW re: MR2 busted for tinted windows Re: MR2 Toyota Quality Re: MR2 TURBO Oil Consuption - 1K/1QT Re: Go to Cabe Toyota was : MR2 Toyota Dealers are a JOKE ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Mark Sink Date: Wed, 20 Aug 1997 07:01:41 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: MR2 Toyota Dealers are a JOKE - ---Jason Church wrote: > Well, you are lucky! I live in a hick town (even though it is the friggin capital of Florida) and there is only one dealer. They tried to sell me an oil filter for $13.50. And when I asked the parts MANAGER why it was so high, he said, like I was annoying him, "well, your car's worth alot more than that." Yeah, but my car's worth alot more than $1000 but I wouldn't pay that for an oil filter. I could tell that Bubba couldn't be reasoned with, so I left, and Austin T was kind enough to get me Toyota filters for $3.50 each. I wouldn't pay any more than that! All that trouble for an oil filter. Must be nice to live in a real town with more than 1 dealer, no competition = high prices! Actually I live in a VERY hick town with NO dealers. I'd say we've got a few thousand people in Fuquay-Varina, NC. When I speak about price shopping and competition, I mean mail order and performance parts, but the same applies to local Toy parts. I'm just glad not everyone charges retail for stuff, and that's what would have to happen for everyone to charge the same price. That's a bad thing. === Mark Sink http://toy4two.home.mindspring.com/ '87 MR2 / '93 MR2 Turbo _____________________________________________________________________ Sent by RocketMail. Get your free e-mail at http://www.rocketmail.com ------------------------------ From: Hank Wallace Date: Wed, 20 Aug 1997 10:05:16 -0400 Subject: RE: MR2 OOPS!! (A wet weather driving adventure in a '93 NA) I also have a motorcycle that I don't ride anymore because of this. I actually had an accident a few years ago in front of a gas station. While trying to avoid an idiot that didn't see me coming I hit the always present oil patch (they are required in front of all gas stations, right?) and went down. I am ok now, but I couldn't walk for about 4 months after the accident. Now that I have my MR2, the motorcycle is for sale! Anyone want one? :) Hank '93 Black NA On Wednesday, August 20, 1997 7:48 AM, B_Caldwell [SMTP:phybrcx@panther.Gsu.EDU] wrote: > > > > From: SupraGuy1@aol.com > > Date: Tue, 19 Aug 1997 21:54:21 -0400 (EDT) > > Subject: MR2 OOPS!! (A wet weather driving adventure in a '93 NA) > > > > kinda like somebody lost about 4 quarts of power steering fluid on that turn. > > > > This is *exactly* why I don't own a motorcycle anymore. You WILL lay it > down because of crap like this! Also, good to know that MR2's can handle > their own off-road! > > ***** vi: what a great way to ESC! ******************* > Bryan Caldwell > '85 Red > phybrcx@gsu.edu > ------------------------------ From: KlingK@aol.com Date: Wed, 20 Aug 1997 10:07:43 -0400 (EDT) Subject: MR2 TURBO Oil Consuption - 1K/1QT Hi all ! I know these conditions have been on here before but I never saw the results.... The Facts: 91 MR2 Turbo 128K miles Oil Consumption 1 Qt / 1000 miles approx Some oil in pipes leading to intercooler No visible oil in intake size of compressor housing No Lateral play in turbine wheel Small amount of axial play in turbine wheel no apparent oil burning i.e. no smoke The guess at what it could be: What does everyone think - anything else I should look at ? I'm guessing turbo oil seals - but I don't know how much oil is "normal" from the pcv in to pre-intercooler pipes - I have more oil after the turbo in the intake side than before the turbo which I would guess is a sign that the bearings are leaking .... Any suggestions - I'm prepared to rebuild the turbo soon unless someone can convince me otherwise .... Thanks in advance ! Kevin Kling klingk@aol.com ------------------------------ From: Hank Wallace Date: Wed, 20 Aug 1997 10:42:28 -0400 Subject: RE: MR2 Toyota Dealers are a JOKE Filters for $3.50 each? I also have been quoted a much higher number from the local dealers. Can anyone send me some at that price? I would like a bunch of them! Hank '93 Black NA On Wednesday, August 20, 1997 10:02 AM, Mark Sink [SMTP:do-the-2@rocketmail.com] wrote: > > ---Jason Church wrote: > > > Well, you are lucky! I live in a hick town (even though it is the > friggin capital of Florida) and there is only one dealer. They tried > to sell me an oil filter for $13.50. And when I asked the parts > MANAGER why it was so high, he said, like I was annoying him, "well, > your car's worth alot more than that." Yeah, but my car's worth alot > more than $1000 but I wouldn't pay that for an oil filter. I could > tell that Bubba couldn't be reasoned with, so I left, and Austin T was > kind enough to get me Toyota filters for $3.50 each. I wouldn't pay > any more than that! All that trouble for an oil filter. Must be nice > to live in a real town with more than 1 dealer, no competition = high > prices! > > > Actually I live in a VERY hick town with NO dealers. I'd say we've got > a few thousand people in Fuquay-Varina, NC. When I speak about price > shopping and competition, I mean mail order and performance parts, but > the same applies to local Toy parts. I'm just glad not everyone > charges retail for stuff, and that's what would have to happen for > everyone to charge the same price. That's a bad thing. > > === > Mark Sink > http://toy4two.home.mindspring.com/ > '87 MR2 / '93 MR2 Turbo > _____________________________________________________________________ > Sent by RocketMail. Get your free e-mail at http://www.rocketmail.com > ------------------------------ From: Robin San Date: Thu, 21 Aug 1997 00:45:56 +1100 Subject: Re: MR2:MK1Extra long wheel studs Hi Dave Hmmmm good point, I guess Ill have to make up my spacer with a spigot too. But its at the rear so maybe its not going to be too bad. Thanks for the feedback. I have been told that Jamex make a kit that has all these goodies, longer studs a spacer with spigot... might be worth looking into instead. Thanks again Seeya Robin 89 MK1 NA Daucott@aol.com wrote: > > > I was looking to run some wheel spacers and so need some longer wheel > > studs, anyone know what stud will fit into the original spot. I need > > about 5-7mm longer. > > If you do this how will you make the wheels hubcentric? Better be very > careful torquing down the wheels or say hello to shimmy shimmy/vibrate > vibrate. > > Dave A. > daucott@aol.com ------------------------------ From: "Dysart, Glenn B., Mr., IMCEN" Date: Wed, 20 Aug 1997 10:56:07 -0400 Subject: Re: MR2 OOPS!! (A wet weather driving adventure in a '93 NA) Well Bryan, I have to disagree with you here. A well experienced motorcycle rider looks for this stuff and rides to the road conditions usually better then someone in a cage (car for you non-bike people). That's not to say you won't go down but it does help to be an experienced rider. I have been riding street bikes for 11 years in all kinds of road conditions and have never been "down". Another thing to keep in mind is smart riders were leather gear, boats, and a decent helmet. The amateurs wear the tiny skull caps, T-shirts and shorts. I love my MR2 like the rest of you but if its a nice day out I'm taking the bike. Why? Because there more fun than ANY car and the performance is unbeatable/unbelievable. my .02 Glenn Dysart DysarGB@hqda.army.mil 93 MR2 turbo 87 Corolla SR5 >This is *exactly* why I don't own a motorcycle anymore. You WILL lay it >down because of crap like this! Also, good to know that MR2's can handle >their own off-road! ------------------------------ From: Steve Bagdon Date: Wed, 20 Aug 1997 10:54:52 -0400 Subject: Re: MR2 Toyota Quality Jason Church wrote: > > Someone said recently: > > > C'mon - just buy the Genuine Toyota part, and I'll be you never buy one again > > before the car is sold or dies. > > Hmm.. it seems like many people believe that Toyota parts are magical parts that are superior to everything else. Some people also believe that you can't kill Here's my thinking. I take what my time is worth (what I make at work), then figure how long it takes for a job to get done. If a part is $25 more, but I work under the presumption that it will last a lot longer, then it's worth it to me to buy Genuine Toyota. The other side is, I have to be aware of when Toyota is charging too much for something. But if the choice is $3 vs. $5, or $80 vs. $150, for me (now, did you notice 'for me'?), I make the decision based on dollar/effort. Other's may choose differently, and are invited to. > And... I have the window sticker for my 93 Turbo. $27,500??? Are you kidding me? (Keep in mind it was $27,500 in 1992.) Let's not go there again. Didn't Sammy and I get into a nice flame war over that one? > Sorry, just had to get a few things off my chest. I mean no offense to anyone (except maybe Toyota and 90% of its dealers.) Toyota (and it's dealers) are businesses. Nothing more, nothing less. Steve B. ------------------------------ From: Steve Bagdon Date: Wed, 20 Aug 1997 10:54:50 -0400 Subject: Re: MR2 Toyota Dealers are a JOKE > Well, you are lucky! I live in a hick town (even though it is the friggin capital of Florida) and there is only one dealer. They tried to sell me an oil filter I spent a couple of years in Tallahassee (Tallahickey, for those who spent more then 1 year there and *didn't* go to school). With the Florida Lottery there, I'm suprised there never was a second Toyota dealership, for competition. Lots of cars get bought there, with the 'instant winnings'... :) > PS: I'll start buying Amsoil or Mobil 1 filters for $10 a piece before I would buy a Toyota oil filter for $5 even. Well, I wouldn't go *that* far. C'mon - Toyota can't be all *that* bad. They built the MR2, right? :) Steve B. ------------------------------ From: Jeffrey Ho See Date: Wed, 20 Aug 1997 08:23:12 -0700 Subject: Re: MR2 3SGTE - Big HP rebuild At 11:12 AM 8/20/97 +0800, phelm@aesprodata.com.au wrote: >I mailed out questions last week but got a very >limited response (Mainly people telling me to >gut the boot and run a big intercooler as >shown in the Hyper-Rev MR2 magazine). Yeah but you mentioned Motec and 400HP. Figured you were serious enough to gut the trunk... for that money and trouble. Now do you want 400HP at the drive wheels or 400HP @ the flywheel? 400HP @ the flywheel can take very little sacrifice. 400HP @ the drive wheel OTOH... And of course, the least painless option. NOS/Spray/Squeeze/ Juice/Stuff/Cheat/etc etc. I figure a direct port shot jetted for 150-200hp can be a cool thing. ;D >Could anyone out there who has got a 400HP+ >3S-GTE motor please mail me and let me >know what mods they have done to achieve >this horse power? You wanna talk to Brad Beddell who I hear is doing consulting work for Mr2 hot rodders currently. Perhaps you can fly him out to AU for a vacation of sorts? ;D - - Jeffrey ------------------------------ From: Jeffrey Ho See Date: Wed, 20 Aug 1997 08:25:17 -0700 Subject: Re: BLITZ MR2 At 10:21 PM 8/19/97 -0500, Bryan Carlson wrote: >the highway." Sure enough they did. I guess they neede dthe big turbo b/c >the volume of the extra intercooler pipe and the GIANT intercooler in the trunk. That thing must be LAG city. But of course, on the track you're never really low on the throttle. Unless of course you're track is a Solo II one. >Hey, anybody in Japan able to check on the availibilty of their front end >lower wing? Looks ok but also looks like it will really help stabilize the >car at high speed. Nah you want the Garage Shark Fin. More gaudy and threatening. =^) - - Jeffrey ------------------------------ From: Jeffrey Ho See Date: Wed, 20 Aug 1997 08:28:51 -0700 Subject: Re: dyerjoe: MR2 MK2 T Crack in Exhaust header At 08:22 PM 8/19/97 -0700, Joe Dyer wrote: >I hate to repeat myself. Its a sign of getting OLD! But almost noone >(just Michelle) responded to my plea for information. > >Joe Dyer - SF Bay Area - '92MR2 Turbo w. HKS EVC/Exhaust Joe, 3 bolts hold the turbo heat shield on. Remove these. You may wanna remove your cross brace in order to pull it out w/o hassle. FWIW, my skilled hands can remove it w/o doing so. ;D Anyhow, once removed... you can see your exhaust manifold. Inspect the driver side mount area as I think this is the weaker side. The EGR valve cracks at the stem of the copper/brown tube mount on the cylinder head. If you see a lot of black crap around the base of it... chances are it's leaking. Hope this helps. Now why don't you diagnose my glowing turbo for me? ;D - - Jeffrey p.s. Get some BGBs. ;D ------------------------------ From: "Fernandez Ponce, Cesar Augusto" Date: Wed, 20 Aug 1997 10:03:13 Subject: MR2 MKI POWER WINDOW TOO SLOW Hi everybody, I have a problem with the passenger=B4s side power windows, and it=B4s when I down or up the window with the driver=B4s or passenger=B4= s switch the window roll up or down very slow. How I can fix this problem? Thanks for your help. ------------------------------ From: Troy Pummill Date: Wed, 20 Aug 1997 08:52:08 -0700 Subject: re: MR2 busted for tinted windows Arthur, Was this the only thing you were pull over for? Check www.dmv.ca.gov and see what it says about tinted windows. (I can't connect right now, but I'll bet that the CHP is right). BTW: I was recently informed by a tinter that the CHP is starting to cite window tinting very heavily. Seems they've taken a new interest.... Sorry Troy mailto:trop@hitachi.com ------------------------------ From: Jeffrey Ho See Date: Wed, 20 Aug 1997 08:45:12 -0700 Subject: Re: MR2 Toyota Quality At 08:21 AM 8/20/97 -0400, Jason Church wrote: >Hmm.. it seems like many people believe that Toyota parts are magical >parts that are superior to everything else. Some people also believe >that you can't kill a Toyota. I disagree with both. Are Toyota parts superior? From what I can tell, yes. Can you kill Toyotas? Sure, I did. ;D >Don't get me wrong, I love my 93 Turbo, but I hate Toyota. Their parts are very good, >but the prices they charge (like most manufacturers) is unbelievable. My local dealer >wants $13.50 for an oil filter! I don't think so. Why should an oxygen sensor cost $150?? >You can't tell me it will last 3 times as long as the Bosch part because it costs 3 >times as much? Yes agree, most aftermarket stuff is crap, but there are some good alternatives. Oh come on now. Toyota parts IMNSHO are so far really price nicely compared to my Acura(Honda) Integra parts. An O2 sensor for my Integra was $150 from the dealer. I didn't shop the price around (mail order/Hoehn etc) but that's damn pricey for a 1.8L motor. The O2 sensor for the Mr2T is around $100. Not much diff. FWIW, heated O2 sensor cost $$$. No way around it. My friend's non heated O2 sensor, dealer was $75. Bosch copy was $28. He bought me lunch for saving him the money (not heated? buy a bosch!) Exhaust manifold for 3S-GTE. $130. I won't even want to ask what Honda wants for their B18A or B18B manifold. Sheesh. Oil filters, same. The difference so far between car maintenance for me is tires and fluids (more of it for the Mr2 turbo) Plus the additional requirements of supporting a turbocharged motor (cap, rotor, plugs, rebuilding a turbo, turbo timer, gas, more idling, etc etc) >And about "Toyota's never die." It seems like every other digest someone is talking > about bad transmission synchros or where they can find a used engine. These seem >like death to me! And none too cheap either. My parents had an 84 Camry that >busted timing belts every 6 months once the warranty expired. After fixing it > 3 times at 3 different places, we gave up. At the same time, the car's trannie Yeah I'm not too big on Toyota engineering. Don't get me wrong. Love the car. Don't love Toyota so much. I love Honda engineering, just hate the fact they don't like RWD and torque. Sheesh. I beat the snot out of my Integra and the only thing that major league went wrong was my clutch which I gladly replaced with a buffer one. >And... I have the window sticker for my 93 Turbo. $27,500??? >Are you kidding me? (Keep in mind it was $27,500 in 1992.) What are they charging for a Celica (Slowlica) GTS nowadays? $24-$25k? Surprise surprise, no wonder they're more Civics/Integras/Accords than the Toyota competitors. - - Jeffrey ------------------------------ From: Jeffrey Ho See Date: Wed, 20 Aug 1997 08:50:45 -0700 Subject: Re: MR2 TURBO Oil Consuption - 1K/1QT At 10:07 AM 8/20/97 -0400, KlingK@aol.com wrote: >What does everyone think - anything else I should look at ? The breather mod does help. But I still get a little bit of oil in the intake pipes. I would recommend tightening all your hoses snugly per Kostas findings. - - Jeffrey ------------------------------ From: Jeffrey Ho See Date: Wed, 20 Aug 1997 08:49:58 -0700 Subject: Re: Go to Cabe Toyota was : MR2 Toyota Dealers are a JOKE Oh by the by Jason (and all SoCal'ers listening in) Cabe Toyota in Long Beach (LBC for those in the hiphop) parts shop does mail order and offers a 20-30% discount off of parts if you call them and say "Hey I'm in the Mr2 club." Jeff Barton (parts manager) reads the list occasionally when it's not overwhelming... My dealings with their staff have shown them to be very competent (THIS IS IMPORTANT!), timely (ALSO IMPORTANT!), and hey what about looking up parts? (damn they're quick!) I can't count how many times I fuss @ various parts depts only to have the guy try to find the part I'm interested in take about 15-20 mins (as I sit and say to myself, dammit I could have gone to Cabe instead of waiting here sheesh) Those training seminars let some of the weaker guys squeek by eh? - - Jeffrey ------------------------------ End of mr2-digest V1 #1486