mr2-digest Saturday, January 10 1998 Volume 02 : Number 088 MR2 Clamps_Hose MR2 MkII Knock Sensor LED MR2 MKII Clutch Change Re: MR2 Clamps_Hose MR2 MK1 Weird MR2 Re: Big Black Key Re: mr2-German MR2 MKII Wheels MR2 MKII Turbo Blown Clutch? MR2 MKII yellow owner? Re: MR2 MK1 Weird MR2 MKII Horses stuck in my Clutch MR2 MKI /something that cought my eye Re: MR2 Need Clutch Bleed Tube MR2 MKII Turbo Rain + Corner + Boost = ??? Re: MR2 Mk I: bandwidth waste Re: MR2 net sales and opening COD's Re: MR2 Mk1 Reverse Light Relay Re: MR2 MK1 Weird Re: MR2 Re: Big Black Key Re: MR2 MKI /something that cought my eye Re: MR2 MKII Turbo Rain + Corner + Boost = ??? Re: MR2 MKI speedo cable replacement? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 9 Jan 1998 23:22:53 -0500 From: Kerry Wood Subject: MR2 Clamps_Hose Jamie Dennis writes... >I seem to remember someone posting that they found aircraft >quality hose clamps (at Alamo?)... could someone describe these? >I'm also looking for a source for (colored) silicone vacuum >line, so that I can mount my boost gauge permanently (and >replace some of the stock vacuum line). Hose clamps are available from Alamo. They are worm drive but have additional lenght of clamp material which covers "threads" to avoid cutting into/sticking to hose. Has abt twice clamping force of the standard clamp. I bought 8 of these and installed on Greddy intercooler neoprene connectors to keep from cutting the connectors up. Seems to have worked. Vacuum tubing in blue is available from Alamo - I think it's silicon, maybe neoprene? Available in several sizes. Call Steve or Brice at Alamo. Fairly sure they will be willing to sell this stuff. Hope this helps. Kerry Wood '93T black witch ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 9 Jan 1998 23:23:00 -0500 From: Kerry Wood Subject: MR2 MkII Knock Sensor LED On the subject of knock sensors for the MkII, note that Toyota utilizes two types of sensors - the first produces voltage at only 7kHz; the second produces voltage at 7 kHz plus voltages above and below that frequency. 7kHz is identified as knock, so in the case of the second type, the PCME/ECU interprets the voltage output of the sensor, ignoring any frequencies not 7kHz. The kicker is that the PCME/ECU has to have the other voltages present to determine that the sensor is, in fact, functioning. If no signal is sent from the sensor, the PCME/ECU interprets this as sensor failure and retards timing. So...an LED wired into the circuit to monitor would light under all engine operating conditions unless equipped w/ a filter to respond to only the voltage produced by a 7kHz frequency. I don't know what that voltage is and Toyota ain't talking, either to me or my favorite dealer shop manager regardless of the amount of threatened torture. Does anyone know what the voltage is? Kerry Wood '93T black witch ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 10 Jan 1998 13:01:52 +0800 From: Ivan Wong Subject: MR2 MKII Clutch Change As my 91 MR2 is getting old, the clutch pedal (clutch point?!) is getting higher and higher and I think its about the right time to change it. Is there any recommendation on which clutch to use? or does the stock one still the best? Your recommendation is greatly appreciated. Regards, iVan 91 3SGE Red 52000km ------------------------------ Date: 10 Jan 1998 05:15:09 GMT From: charlesg@cco.caltech.edu (Charles Grosjean) Subject: Re: MR2 Clamps_Hose Kerry Wood writes: >Jamie Dennis writes... >>I seem to remember someone posting that they found aircraft >>quality hose clamps (at Alamo?)... could someone describe these? >Hose clamps are available from Alamo. They are worm drive but have >additional lenght of clamp material which covers "threads" to avoid cutting >into/sticking to hose. Has abt twice clamping force of the standard clamp. Other killer clamps. McMasterCarr sells two that might be suitable for this sort of use. One uses a t-bolt to tighten a band around the tubing, Turbonetics also sells these. The load is uniform, there are no holes to extrude the tubing, the edges are rounded, and they use a locknut. Also, you can buy hose clamps that have belleville washers (springs) so the clamping force is uniform when the hoses expand and contract during use. Charles ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 10 Jan 1998 01:37:48 -0500 From: "TheArk" Subject: MR2 MK1 Weird Tonight I finally changed the O-ring on my distributor shaft to see how much of the oil leak it would clear up...I removed the distributor, and the original O-ring was like a Life-Saver candy....While trying to remove it, it pretty much shattered into a few pieces....Cleaned the distributor, all the grease & stuff fromit, sprayed out the inside with some electric motor cleaner, and replaced the O-ring, and plugged it all back together....When I took it out for a ride, it was unbelievable, the car seemed to have quite a bit more punch!!!! QUITE A BIT...A while ago while the TVIS system was being explained to me, I understood it, but could never really feel any difference in the rpm range/power.....No, when I get up to around 3k rpm's....I can feel the car seem to jump ahead, and wind up the gears a bit quicker....I recall the TVIS system suposedly coming into effect at 4350 rpm....But mine is consistently between 2800 and 3200 rpm....I am not unhappy with this, or dissappointed, just like an explanation.....Anybody, Anybody, Anybody...????? Thanks "Cant you trip like I do?" TheArk@teleweb.net Noah Boehm ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 10 Jan 1998 01:42:23 -0800 From: "Joe Shutte" Subject: MR2 Re: Big Black Key I was just wondering if I can get one of these big black keys for my Mk1 or when did they come out with them? I haven't ever owned another Toyota so I don't know. Thanks in advance. Joe Shutte tjw@one.net 88 Dark Blue Mk1 ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 10 Jan 1998 01:40:44 EST From: Wade1972 Subject: Re: mr2-German MR2 MKII Wheels In a message dated 98-01-09 22:01:40 EST, you write: << Hi all, I just did a few updates to my homepage.There is a MR2 from a german car tuning magazine that shows a VERY nice MR2 MKII.Look for the wheels -WOW! It is said that they are from japan.Does anybody know where to get them from and how much they are? >> The wheels are made by Work and they are a very popular wheel manufacturer in Japan. Go to a good tire/wheel dealer (maybe try tire rack) and see if they can order them. They should be able to get them but you'll have to pay shipping. BTW, I just translated the artice in the wheel/tire section and recognized "Work" in the caption of the picture. Jason 85n/a ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 10 Jan 1998 00:57:08 -0600 From: redmr2@home.com Subject: MR2 MKII Turbo Blown Clutch? I knew it had to happen sonner or later. I was having some fun with an Eclipse and at one point ran 2nd gear to about 7000 rpm. After that I had trouble getting into 3rd gear - things felt strange. I let the rpms come down - still no go. I double clutched it into gear. I now have small problems getting into 5th, downshifting, and a slight clutch chatter every now and then when in 1st gear with the clutch engaged. I think my clutch is fried and on it's way to heaven. Tis expected for 107,000 miles on the stock clutch and running 15psi boost. My question is: Should I replace the pressure plate as well or just the clutch disc? I know I should go with an aftermarket clutch over stock because of my future mods, but which one? I don't auto-x, just spirited daily driving. Will the stock pressure plate work with an aftermarket clutch disc? Where's the cheapest/fastest place to mail order both? I don't expect my 2 to be driveable in a week or so. David G. Red '91T with a fractured leg. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 09 Jan 1998 22:57:15 -0800 From: Randy Chase Subject: MR2 MKII yellow owner? Hey...was browsing around on WWW.NUDE.ORG...just looking for cars...really I swear! Actually this was posted on the autox list by the owner of an RX7 that is selling it. This pic:http://www.nude.org/cashmo/SLINGER1.JPG shows his RX parked, but you see a yellow MR2 up on the track. I believe this is in the midwest US somewhere. Yeah..little MR2 content. Randy Chase *hey, where can I get one of them MKI badges?* '91 MR2 N/A ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 10 Jan 1998 02:37:57 EST From: Spider1979 Subject: Re: MR2 MK1 Weird TVIS.. I have been looking at that thing for about as long as i have had my car wondering what it does... ,so i now have people to ask, What is it?.. or better yet, is there an FAQ that i should look at, im sure it would answer many questions for me, and i would have to ask you guys(slang not sexisim) alot less... TIA David the pixie boy.. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 10 Jan 1998 20:52:21 +1300 From: Trevor Johnston Subject: MR2 MKII Horses stuck in my Clutch Hi all, Since I got back from my New Years holiday I noticed my Clutch Problems have came back- however this time it is is slipping majorly, especially in 4th and 5th gear at 4000rpm+ and under mild to heavy boost. So I feel now could be the time for an overhaul. Being a Poor University student (with huge car payments) I dont have much option but to do the work myself with the helping hand of my Mechanic Friend. However as I hardly know the difference between a flywheel and a steering wheel I have a few Questions: 1. I am considering using a more bullet proof clutch kit, as it seems the Stock Toyota ones cant quite hack the Horses coming from the engine. I do alot of around town driving so my car has to be practical, but I'd love something with more feel, maybe something a bit firmer, and more race bred. Does anyone have any suggestions for a decent priced aftermarket clutch kit (that I could buy over here in New Zealand) that could keep the horses in the axle where they belong?. 2. There is very little information on MR2.com. discussing the technique to replace the clutch. I think there should be considering that the Clutch seems to be one of the few weaknesses of the MKII MR2 and seems to be a major weakness in the Turbo version. I have already written to Chris King asking for *something* concerning the MKII Clutch to be added to the Revised FAQ he is writing at the moment, but there must be someone out there who has done the job themselves and is willing to write a detailed explaination of what is involved and 'how to'- This could be of benefit to the group, Especially me ;-) ,and maybe Geoff could add it to the Web Site?. Thanks in advance - ---- Elliot Johnston 1990 Toyota MR2 GT Red, T-Tops, 5-Speed, TURBO - ---- ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 10 Jan 1998 02:56:14 EST From: Spider1979 Subject: MR2 MKI /something that cought my eye In a message dated 98-01-09 22:42:18 EST, WeyrAbouts@aol.com writes: << 85-86 Front Valance Panels still avail ... >> i have noticed that there are several groups of MR2, or even subgroups... you have the 85-86, and then the 88-90SC/NA.. and then the MKII's .. what was the difference between 85-86, and the 87's??did somethng change(other than the lil vent on the side)... i only ask because i have seen people take parts from an 85, and put them on an 86, but i have never heard of any interplay with the parts from an 85-86, and and 87.. is there something that makes that not a good idea, or is it just that i have never heard of it David the pixie boy ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 10 Jan 1998 03:00:40 EST From: Spider1979 Subject: Re: MR2 Need Clutch Bleed Tube In a message dated 98-01-09 22:38:33 EST, you write: << I need a clutch bleed tube for a 1985 MR2, Manual Transmission. This is the line which comes out of the top of the slave cylinder and has a bleed screw at the other end. Let me know if you can help >> I believe that you can go to a hardware store and get a piece of clear plastic tube (cut to the size you want) it should only cost a few cent's thats what i did when i did my clutch(or should i say had a friend do my clutch, i just paid for the beer) ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 10 Jan 1998 00:33:35 -0800 From: "Joseph Rago" Subject: MR2 MKII Turbo Rain + Corner + Boost = ??? Yep you guessed it---- A MAJOR directional change. Even though Ive had my car 8 months now Ive only driven it in the wet 3 times now since I live in the desert. The first 2 times I babied it because I wasn't used to the car at all, but this time I drove it as I would normally would thinking I could handle any minor traction losses the rain might pose-----NOT!! Im coming around a right hand corner in a turn lane where 2 major streets connect at approx. 30mph-- no problems through the corner but as Im 95% through I start to ease on to the throttle------NO WARNING NO RECOVERY----within a matter of 2 seconds Im pointed 180* from where I was attempting to go. Luckily the people behind me had room to dodge me and I slid into an open lane. I could only imagine the damage if I had been on a freeway onramp *CRINGE*. SO WHAT IS MY POINT??? I have spent a LOT of time sliding sideways, doing doughnuts, and driving at 11/10's but I could NOT see this coming and I could NOT recover it when it started to spin. Please be careful in the wet if you drive a mkii--especially a turbo because this car WILL BITE YOU if you get over confident. I hope my story keeps someone from smacking their car into a stationary -- read:HARD-- object. Joe Rago ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 10 Jan 1998 07:32:24 -0400 From: bagdon@rust.net (S and K Bagdon) Subject: Re: MR2 Mk I: bandwidth waste >In a message dated 98-01-09 06:36:05 EST, you write: > ><< I take it the clock showed up, finally.>> >No, not yet. Am still patiently waiting. > ><> >Huh? I'm BLONDE remember? Having a clock does not indicate ability to tell >time ;) Please, don't start down this road. That's like me telling 'geek jokes' - sooner or later, one hits home... :) Steve B. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 10 Jan 1998 07:32:21 -0400 From: bagdon@rust.net (S and K Bagdon) Subject: Re: MR2 net sales and opening COD's >have yet to find an aftermarket parts store that is not >staffed by attitude riddled, snotty nosed, sniveling little punks. So, start a store of your own, if you think you can do so much better... Steve B. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 10 Jan 1998 07:32:13 -0400 From: bagdon@rust.net (S and K Bagdon) Subject: Re: MR2 Mk1 Reverse Light Relay >('86 MR2) A while ago I noticed my white backup lights weren't working. I >had it diagnosed as a bad reverse light relay (84210-60021), and I have >finally ordered and received said relay (now called a switch) from my local >Toyota dealer. I have the Hanes and the BGB, and I can't figure out where >this thing goes. Anybody know? Transmission, under the battery tray, around where the thermostat housing is. Look for a switch screwed into the tranny, with a wire coming out, then a white connector. Steve B. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 10 Jan 1998 07:32:31 -0400 From: bagdon@rust.net (S and K Bagdon) Subject: Re: MR2 MK1 Weird >Tonight I finally changed the O-ring on my distributor shaft to see how >much of the oil leak it would clear up...I removed the distributor, and the >original O-ring was like a Life-Saver candy....While trying to remove it, >it pretty much shattered into a few pieces....Cleaned the distributor, all >the grease & stuff fromit, sprayed out the inside with some electric motor >cleaner, and replaced the O-ring, and plugged it all back together....When >I took it out for a ride, it was unbelievable, the car seemed to have quite >a bit more punch!!!! QUITE A BIT...A while ago while the TVIS system was >being explained to me, I understood it, but could never really feel any >difference in the rpm range/power.....No, when I get up to around 3k >rpm's....I can feel the car seem to jump ahead, and wind up the gears a bit >quicker....I recall the TVIS system suposedly coming into effect at 4350 >rpm....But mine is consistently between 2800 and 3200 rpm....I am not >unhappy with this, or dissappointed, just like an explanation.....Anybody, >Anybody, Anybody...????? >Thanks Was the timing the same after you replaced the o-ring as before you replaced the o-ring (as you had to remove the distributor body). Steve B. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 10 Jan 1998 07:32:35 -0400 From: bagdon@rust.net (S and K Bagdon) Subject: Re: MR2 Re: Big Black Key >I was just wondering if I can get one of these big black >keys for my Mk1 or when did they come out with them? >I haven't ever owned another Toyota so I don't know. The 'big' black key only works for the Mk II, at least when I asked about buying one for my Mk I. Steve B. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 10 Jan 1998 07:32:38 -0400 From: bagdon@rust.net (S and K Bagdon) Subject: Re: MR2 MKI /something that cought my eye >In a message dated 98-01-09 22:42:18 EST, WeyrAbouts@aol.com writes: > ><< 85-86 Front Valance Panels still avail ... >> >i have noticed that there are several groups of MR2, or even subgroups... you >have the 85-86, and then the 88-90SC/NA.. and then the MKII's .. what was the >difference between 85-86, and the 87's??did somethng change(other than the lil >vent on the side)... Major reivision change was the '85-'86 and the '87-'89. The brakes changed, the rear suspensio changed, the interior changed, the rear-trunk insides (new engine wiring harness, new air flow tubing, etc). > i only ask because i have seen people take parts from an >85, and put them on an 86, but i have never heard of any interplay with the >parts from an 85-86, and and 87.. is there something that makes that not a >good idea, or is it just that i have never heard of it You've just never heard of them. 90% of the entire Mk I line is interchangable, but the other 10% is some important stuff. Steve B. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 10 Jan 1998 07:32:42 -0400 From: bagdon@rust.net (S and K Bagdon) Subject: Re: MR2 MKII Turbo Rain + Corner + Boost = ??? >I hope my story keeps someone from smacking their car into >a stationary -- read:HARD-- object. Probably not. Someone must post a testimonial about this type of experience ('I didn't believe it until it happened to me, so don't you all do it') about once ever 2 months or so. It snowed here in Detroit during the Ford 'Christmas break', but I had to go in a few days into work. The parking lot for World Headquarters is rether large (not shopping mall large, but large enough), and there was about 2" of fresh and un-driven-over snow. I decided to try a few donuts (who can resist a parking lot, no cars, and fresh snow!) and was reminded of why I hate driving the MR2 in fresh snow. Even with Road Huggers (presumed better all-season tires then A-509s or AVSi's) it was 'entertaining'. The most interesting part was that things would happen *after* I would expect them to. I'd drive in a constant diameter circle while increasing speed, then at a certain speed I'd start letting up off the gas (and no, it was instant, so no off-throttle comments). When I reached constant speed (vs. acceleration or decelleration), the back end would come out, and there was absolutely nothing I could do with it (until the car lost all momentum, in all directions). I believe this is what suprised people the most with the MR2, about terminal oversteer - when it hits, it hits *after* you would expect it to, really confusing the crap out of the driver. Steve B. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 10 Jan 1998 07:32:17 -0400 From: bagdon@rust.net (S and K Bagdon) Subject: Re: MR2 MKI speedo cable replacement? >my speedo cable is broken and I've not been able to find any info on the >exact routing or replacement procedure in the toyota BGB. i assume it's >something like my VW bug's cable replacement tricks (tape leading edge, use >the old one to pull the other through, etc..) but that's a guess. >comments/hints from anyone who's performed this before would be most >appreciated. Expect a fun few hours. Remove the 3 plastic panels under the car (below the gas tank), then remove the cable in 'sections' and install the new cable as you go. The cable will start at the tranny, wrap up/over the engine/tranny, then start going underneath the car. It will follow the gas tank (going above two cross member braces), then twist it's way up ito the front-trunk, then into the passenger compartment. The hardest parts are getting the cable unscrewed from the tranny (threaded ring corrodes to the speedo cable) and getting the cable unattached from the gauge cluster (just darn tight in there). Steve B. ------------------------------ End of mr2-digest V2 #88