mr2-digest Saturday, January 23 1999 Volume 02 : Number 2335 Re: MR2 THE TRUTH! About the 2000 MR-2 Spyder! MR2 LW Flywheels MR2 AFM voltage readings Re: MR2 Pricing for a 93T Re: MR2 MKII - Painting lower body moldings Re: MR2 blitz intake for mkii turbo Re: MR2 re:more info on 7AGE, please? MR2 Optima batteries Re: MR2 Short throw kit for $25 MR2 MK1 front mudflaps Re: MR2 20 Valve 4AGZE Re: MR2 RE Toyota F1 Re: MR2 MKii NA Cam MR2 MKI extra Distributer wires....need help!!! Re: MR2 THE TRUTH! About the 2000 MR-2 Spyder! Re: MR2 THE TRUTH! About the 2000 MR-2 Spyder! (No MR2 Content) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1999 21:22:26 -0600 From: "Chris King" Subject: Re: MR2 THE TRUTH! About the 2000 MR-2 Spyder! >Maybe the mrs isnt coming to US? See nobody knows *for sure* but >Toyota.. I think at this point, it is quite obvious that the MRS is coming to the states. I would put the chances at around 99.999% >From what it sounds like everybody and their dog owns mr-2's in >japan so the market there would be good for both.. Far from the truth... and sales in Japan have gradually staled. Consider now that the MR2 has not undergone a major change (say like from the mki to mkii) in what 8, 9 years? That's unbelievable for a car in Japan... Remember how long the japanese keep their cars due to government regulations... >Kinda like 4-runner vs. Land Cruser? Not really. First off, these are both in the SUV category which creams sports car sales hands down. Secondly, the 4-Runner is positioned as toyota's entry level SUV, the Land Cruiser as a top of the line "luxury" SUV. I have a hard time believing that Toyota would try and do the same with the MRS/MR2. That means the price of one would have to be a lot more than the other and the MR2 is already reasonably priced in Japan. Therefore, the MRS would have to become the "luxury" sports car. And I think it obvious that the MRS is not going to be positioned as this. >And Toyota obvously dosnt want you to know what the car >looks like befor its debut so dont you think its possible blurred car on >the toy website is a cover up? No, I think it's a marketing scam to try and build some hype. Just look closely at the pics of the MRS and the mosaic'ed pic on the Toyota site. Here are the URL's again: Toyota pic: http://www.toyota.com/vehicles/future/images/concept_car_hdr.jpg MRS pic: http://www.btinternet.com/~netsurf/mr2t/bms98/sMRSFRONT.jpg It has the same vent on the side (which is for the engine; not the brakes as you stated), it's convertible, it's 2 door 2 seater, it has the halogen headlights, etc. And those are all things you can make out from the mosaic'ed pic. >Hell that could be the new celica for all >we know... thats gonna be new for the year 2k also... Those slits in >the side you see are for the "13 rear disk cooling system.. I don't think so. Bye. Chris K. Yellow 93 Turbo Silver 87 NA ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1999 19:25:28 -0800 From: "Derek D. Saville" Subject: MR2 LW Flywheels Some people have asked about flywheels lately...the March issue Turbo magazine project MR2 gained 8 peek hp and 5 ft-lbs of torque with an allum. flyweel weighing in at 8 lbs. The flywheel was also installed with an ACT clutch. The largest improvement was at 4500 rpm were the car gained 13 hp and 8 ft-lbs of torque. The dyno plots show a slight loss in torque and hp below 3700 rpm. The disclaimer is that the boost pressure went up about 1 psi when they did the runs witht he lightweight flywheel. So they readjusted the boot pressure down one psi and said they still made improvemnts over stock but they didn't quantify them. They also tested the new A'PEXi GT exhaust which gained hp and torque across the entire powerband, and they tested a prototype A'PEXi intercooler (same setup as the Greddy with a different fin design) which dropped intake temperatures from 101 degrees to 85 during highway cruising and peek temperatures from 119 to 97 degrees. Derek ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1999 21:35:53 -0600 From: "Searles" Subject: MR2 AFM voltage readings Does anyone know (or know where to find) the expected voltage readings from the AFM while the engine is running for a 91T. I am getting approx. 3.0 volts at idle and 0.5 volts at WOT. My engine is running fine but with a supply voltage of 5 volts to the meter, I would expect it to utilize a wider operating range. Has anyone else looked at this? Steve 91T ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1999 21:33:38 -0600 From: "Chris King" Subject: Re: MR2 Pricing for a 93T >Car in my name, ins. in my name >Geico - 753 down, and 595 a month for FC, 500 deductible on all things >Progressive - 999 down and 479 a month/FC 500 deductible >I'm 18, perfect driving record..... driving for 1 year, 11 months. Well, to put it simply, you are going to be out of luck. Recommendations: 1) Put the car under your parent's policy and sign yourself up as the primary driver on one of their cars. Some companies will let you do this. State Farm, for example, did this automatically for my family when I first got my car (a dodge daytona - yuck!). Since it is a 93 though, you will still probably be out of luck. 2) Go for a 91-92 non-turbo. Much cheaper rates. FWIW, I am only 20 (turn 21 in May). I pay $750/6 months on my 93 turbo (full coverage). I got my 91 NA when I was 17 and I was paying $675/6 months at the time (full coverage). A 91 turbo would have run me $50 more per 6 months. I have had all my MR2's under my own policy, seperate from my parents cars. I have saved serious $$$ with my good student discount. Without it, my 93 would be $1035/6 months. In addition, I checked to see what I will be paying when I hit 21. My rates on my 93 will then go down to $440/ 6 months. I think your best bet is to go for a 91-92 non-turbo. You will pay a lot less on insurance and you don't have to worry so much about what the previous owner did to the car. Purchasing an abused turbocharged car that needs work done to it will empty your pocketbooks real quick. Chris K. Yellow 93 Turbo Silver 87 NA ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1999 19:50:03 -0800 From: Byron Johnson Subject: Re: MR2 MKII - Painting lower body moldings Go to a paint store that sells automotive paint to body shops. They can sell you the color you want in spray cans. If you go to a body shop, you're just introducing a middleman who will want a cut. Drew Ragan wrote: > I was wanting to do the same thing, but I cant seem to find my color > in any spray paints (like Dupli Color). Its Terquoise Pearl - a 92-93 > color. Toyota doesnt have it in spray either. Any suggestions or > contacts other than to go to a body shop?? > > - -- Byron Johnson 93 Turbo SF Bay Area ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1999 19:58:03 PST From: "Will C." Subject: Re: MR2 blitz intake for mkii turbo You know what? I mentioned this item quite a while ago and no one was interested or even responded. Funny. Anyhow, I figured people thought I was spamming or something. The SUS filter you are refering is a relatively new thing in the states and that means that it's untested by anyone w/ a dyno or a flowbench. I'm waiting for them (magazines?) to compare the SUS from Blitz vs. FIPK from K&N or the foam type from HKS. I've had my eyes on the also relatively new Turbo filter from RS Akimoto. This one looks promising as well. Hope people actually responded to your inquiry. It's rare unless you bring up a topic that catches. Try something like: "MR2 Turbo sucks in comparison to Honda Accord. ALSO - Does anyone know about the SUS filter from Blitz?" :P - ----Original Message Follows---- Date: Thu, 21 Jan 1999 21:13:47 -0800 From: Nick Yee To: mr2-digest@mr2.com Subject: MR2 blitz intake for mkii turbo hey all, does anyone have info and/or pics of the blitz intake system for 91 mr2 turbo? i reserved the only one in stock at Pann Auto (driving down saturday i think) along with h&r springs and tokico shocks (yay, finally get to drop my car)....but i'm hoping it's as good as it sounds. supposedly a fine stainless steel mesh filter cone? i hope someone out there has info and a pic (that would be really great!) thanks in advance... nick ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1999 21:56:55 -0600 From: "Steve N." Subject: Re: MR2 re:more info on 7AGE, please? This is another topic that has been discussed on the Toyota mods list, as a matter of fact, there is someone that is currently in the process of building up a 7A-GZE. Here is an old e-mail I saved that you all might be intrested in. If you want more info, the guys on Toyota Mods list know alot, one of which is mr2 lister Steve G. (as if you already didn't know that he knew alot ;) I too would be intrested in this, although if I ever do an engine swap it will probably be for the 20V. Steve N. xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Tue, 22 Sep 1998 18:03:56 +0100 From: "Justin Timbrell" Subject: Project 7AGZE Quick info note for all interested ; ) Recently my 4AGZE conversion into a Corolla GTi AE92 (FX 16) went into the garage to check if water had got any further than in the inlet ports when it was imported. Digging deeper it was found that some slight corrosion had got into the bores and on top of that the crank bearings had worn quite badly. Though the engine hadn't shown any sign of stress and was producing good power figures. So anyway as some may know last year I chucked together a 1800cc conversion from a 7A bottom and 4AGE 16V head. Well this has been sitting around in the back of the garage for 6 months and I had always thought what a GZE version might produce. So I got the garage mob (they know me quite well as my car has been in there for 3 months this year) to strip both engines and start to rebuild all the best bits and mod where cost effective. So at the moment the list is as follows... 1800cc 7A bottom end, lightened and balanced crank and rods. Bores honed. GZE forged pistons onto 7A rods. Oil sump pan with oil return pipe for oil cooler from original 4AGE engine. GZE SC12 supercharger with largest crank pulley fitted. Timing wheel fitted to crank pulley for MBE ECU timing. GZE 16V head flowed and ported, mainly exhaust ports widened a little. Valves cut and angled. lightened 7A flywheel with up rated 212mm clutch plate and GZE cover plate. 6 speed box from 4EFE Corolla G6 heavily modified to fit 4A/7A block. Up rated engine mounts, tubular steel exhaust manifold and stainless steel sports exhaust (don't need to fit a CAT). You might ask why don't I just add a turbo and get major BHP figures. Well I hope to get 200 BHP from this lot at 10 PSI boost without the complication of the SC/Turbo installation. Plus most of the parts are still standard and should last as well as be easy to replace. I'll be posting the results in a couple of weeks though it will need some time to bed things in and get the mapping perfect. JUSTIN xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1999 20:14:23 -0800 From: william brandt Subject: MR2 Optima batteries I have had one in my Mercedes for 3 years - can't say enough good. Other MB list members in the snow country say they start fast every time - they emit no hydrogen because they are a different technology. I first came into contact with them looking at a perfect Porsche 914 - (before my MR2) and owner used one to prevent rust in the pan. Bill ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 22 Jan 99 20:14:00 P From: Ralph Hill Subject: Re: MR2 Short throw kit for $25 I second Donald's comments. Jon Oellrich's short shift kit is great. When you see it, you may think, "I paid $25 for this little piece of metal?" Don't kid yourself. The MKII version is very precisely made, and there is a LOT of thought in it. And, don't think that because it looks so simple you don't need to read the instructions! On my third try, I finally read all the [well written, clear] instructions, twice. Then I got it in in about 2 minutes. My opinion: I great piece of engineering. Good price. Read instructions. ralph hill 92 NA (Konis go in any day now) ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1999 20:19:16 PST From: "Todd klosnick" Subject: MR2 MK1 front mudflaps Does anyone know were I can get a set of "USED" front molded MR2 mudflaps for my 87 MR2? thanks, TOdd 87na ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1999 17:01:59 +1300 From: "Richard Doig" Subject: Re: MR2 20 Valve 4AGZE > > Anyway, I assume the place I made mention of yesterday has 20v's in >>stock that they're trying to get rid of, and, supercharger >>notwithstanding, you've got to admit that it's a damned good price, and >>they carry a 1 year guarantee. The 16v's are a little bit less money. >>They seem to be priced to sell, if any of you N/A guys are interested in >>a project. >Do they also have the wire loom, ECU and AFM? It'd be pretty hard to fit a >20v into any car without them, unless you are planning on using an >aftermarket ECU. Another point to ponder is that the 20v engine was only ever front mounted. In the MR2 you will have to make changes to things like water piping etc. If anything like the 3S-GTE the water outlet from the head will be backwards. Also the wiring harnesses sometimes need changing, again because of the way the engine is mounted. If installing a Japan motor in a US car this is often an important point, as on front engined cars the harnesses generally go through the firewall on the drivers side (and hence the Japan & US harnesses differ). This will not be an easy one weekend bolt-in swap! I'm converting a Japan MR2 3S-GTE to fit a Celica, and it is no easy task. Richard 1987 Celica GT-Four ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1999 17:28:53 +1300 From: "Richard Doig" Subject: Re: MR2 RE Toyota F1 >>Yeah I reakon! The only races Toyota Team Europe have ever won are a few >>World Rally Championships. > > "a few World Rally Championships"?? Are you serious? Nah, I wasn't! >> They came within 400m of winning the 1998 Rally >>Championship but the car caught fire, useless! > > No, not useless. No, but bloody infuriating! >Regards, >Stephen Gunter. icq 285675 Um, Stephen, I think you missed the last word of my post. It was 'sarcasm'... Just making a statement that Toyota should not be judged on one US race series when they have had major success in more internationally compeditive championships. Believe me, I'm a die hard Toyota fan (including standing in a forest in the middle of no-where while it is pouring down in mid-winter, just to get splatted with mud by Carlos Sainz flying past at full cry) and know how hard they have worked! I'll throw in more happy faces next time... :-) Richard 1987 Celica GT-Four ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1999 19:54:06 -0800 From: Matt Gawlowski Subject: Re: MR2 MKii NA Cam Mike Dodd wrote: > MR2 Perfromance Products makes a performance cam for the NA that listers > say is a big help in hp. Has anyone out there gotten their car smogged with this cam? > I was talking about a port and polish for my NA, they said that I could get > another 1000RPM redline out of the engine as a result of it being able to > breath better! Is this true, and if so, is it bad for the engine??? Yeah, it's true. The car, as you know, runs out of breath at high rpms, and anything you can do to help will be good. Is it bad for the engine? Depends. I'll be looking at this in depth after my cylinder head mods (to be installed this summer, AFTER my smog check). I can think of three concerns right now about raising the redline: 1. Piston Velocity. Higher rpms=piston moves faster, of course. This puts added loads on the bearings and piston itself. I need to research what's acceptable, but if it's a problem then a shorter stroke may be needed. 2. Valve springs 'float'. If the springs begin to resonate, it could lead to, at worst, the spring shattering into pieces. 3. REV LIMITER. I'm not sure if I've bounced off a limiter or the engine just ran out of steam, but I think it's the former. The solution is one that will benefit the engine in other ways - a new engine management system, like the TEC-II. I'm sure there are other concerns as well. But heck, we wont' know till we try. - -Matt G., '91 White NA ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1999 23:52:20 EST From: IkonoSin@aol.com Subject: MR2 MKI extra Distributer wires....need help!!! O.K....Here's the problem, there is a set of wires coming out of my distributor that doesn't lead anywhere. One wire pigtails into two wires, one male and one female. The connectors look like the wires going from the fan to the distributor. Now I realize that it's color coded, but both of my extra wires are gray. Why the hell would one wire split into two just to reattach? Both of the white wires are connected, and so are both of the green, just the gray need a home. Please Help!!! Scott, '86 MR2 N/A BTW, there is also a black wire coming out of the distributor that needs a home!!! ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1999 23:53:08 -0500 From: "Jeff Condon" Subject: Re: MR2 THE TRUTH! About the 2000 MR-2 Spyder! I as a Toyota sales consultant pass on to you all the "truth" about what I have been told! My district managers have driven both the new Celica and the new MR?. The fact of the matter is that the new Celica is reality....due in spring of 2000. The concept car based on the MR2 is/ will only be introduced after the Celica has its hay day! I have a few pictures of the new Celica and the new "z" car on my web page. It can be accessed at http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/Lane/6602/JeffsAutomot.html Jeff Condon Toyota Silver Sales Society Consultant 1990 240SX Eibach Sportlines, Tokico struts, ST swaybars, HKS Sport Exhaust, Hot Shot Headers, UR Pulley, Place Racing CAI, Clarion Pro-Audio Head and EQ, Clarion components with BlaupunkTweets, Pyle 4x6, Dual Bazooka Tubes, Custom white accent interior with hole in carpet (hehe) 85 Toyota MR2 Stock with 151,000 miles and counting (future restoration project) 95 Acura Integra (fiancee) 40,000 miles (stock) 95 Kawasaki Ninja ZX6 8000 miles - -----Original Message----- From: Steven Hausherr To: mr2-interest@mr2.com Date: Friday, January 22, 1999 2:02 PM Subject: MR2 THE TRUTH! About the 2000 MR-2 Spyder! >Actually its just another rumor, but i heard there will be no MR-S.. Its >gonna be called MR-2 Spyder and its gonna have a 1.8L all aluminum >turbo... Its not gonna even look like the MR-S.. But production will >start in september.. Any Way.. I just got My *Brand Spanking New* HP >OPENVIEW Network Node manager platform Here at work!!! Version 5.01!! So >im gonna install it!! Be back in a month! J/K... > >Steven > >______________________________________________________ >Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com > ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1999 17:32:49 +1030 From: "Simon Lake" Subject: Re: MR2 THE TRUTH! About the 2000 MR-2 Spyder! (No MR2 Content) >I as a Toyota sales consultant pass on to you all the "truth" about what I >have been told! My district managers have driven both the new Celica and >the new MR?. The fact of the matter is that the new Celica is >reality....due in spring of 2000. The concept car based on the MR2 is/ will >only be introduced after the Celica has its hay day! I have a few pictures >of the new Celica and the new "z" car on my web page. It can be accessed at >http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/Lane/6602/JeffsAutomot.html >Jeff Condon >Toyota Silver Sales Society Consultant > >1990 240SX Eibach Sportlines, Tokico struts, ST swaybars, >HKS Sport Exhaust, Hot Shot Headers, UR Pulley, Place Racing >CAI, Clarion Pro-Audio Head and EQ, >Clarion components with BlaupunkTweets, Pyle 4x6, >Dual Bazooka Tubes, Custom white accent interior with >hole in carpet (hehe) > >85 Toyota MR2 >Stock with 151,000 miles and counting >(future restoration project) > >95 Acura Integra (fiancee) >40,000 miles (stock) Wow! You're getting married to an Acura Integra? That's really taking a passion for cars to a new level :) ------------------------------ End of mr2-digest V2 #2335