So the beams goes in this weekend

mr220v · 01-24-2007, 01:50 PM

With my wife out of town, and a whole weekend at my disposal, its time to act on my 2 months of planning and wiring.

I have my motor ready to go already fitted with gen3 3sgte water outlet housing and crank pulley. I plan on reusing my s54 tranny and possibly my existing clutch, flywheel, pressureplate and TO bearing. Unfortunately, the msd tach adapter was out of stock at my local shop, so i'll just have to add that later.

The wiring has been taken care of as well. My harness is based off of my stock 5sfe engine harness and the cut celica beams harness I received with my engine. If all goes well, I will be able to make more of these for anybody wanting to attempt this swap later.

So, aside from any grotesque wiring mistake, I should have a running beams transplant Sunday. Total costs should not exceed $1500. Pretty good for a US beams conversion.

Edophus · 01-24-2007, 01:57 PM

$1500 well spent! Good luck with the swap

PHOENIX · 01-24-2007, 05:47 PM

Wow, Take lots of pictures for us!

Very nice work!

puretone · 01-25-2007, 03:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mr220v

Unfortunately, the msd tach adapter was out of stock at my local shop, so i'll just have to add that later.

im gonna look in my BEAMS clip to see where the hell it is that the tach signal gets its gender-bending done.....i dont get how it is handled, there has to be some sort of OEM tach adaptering going on in there....im using the BEAMS cluster in my rig (ST184) right now, to my surprise the tach signal (with the MSD tach adapter) makes the BEAMS cluster tacho work as it should.....im funfused

mr220v · 01-25-2007, 09:18 AM

The actual signal sent to the cluster is generated at the ecu on the beams, and other direct fire toyotas. On older toyotas, the tach signal was created by the igniter.

I used the msd 8920 once before. It was on my first 20v when I was using an msd blaster. The signal would not work with my toyota tach.

It seems that the beams tach signal is the more standardized type.

puretone · 01-25-2007, 12:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mr220v

The actual signal sent to the cluster is generated at the ecu on the beams, and other direct fire toyotas. On older toyotas, the tach signal was created by the igniter.

I used the msd 8920 once before. It was on my first 20v when I was using an msd blaster. The signal would not work with my toyota tach.

It seems that the beams tach signal is the more standardized type.

yeah i know....which is why its so wierd that the tacho signal still works even with the tach adapter to the BEAMS gauges cluster that im using now....i spent 2 weeks figuring out where and how all the wires go from the original ST184 cluster to where their equivalent locations are on the ST202/BEAMS cluster that i got with my clip (i asked for it specifically bc of the correct milage & just bc i wanted to be different by having the BEAMS cluster in my rig...)
The thing that i dont get is that if i run the TACH signal from the ECU to the cluster then it doesnt work, but if its thru the tach adapter then it does work...which is why i got to thinking that there is some sort of OEM tach adapter thing somewhere...

any idea?

mr220v · 01-25-2007, 01:00 PM

As near as I can tell, its a straight shot from the ecu to the tach.

When you set up you tach adapter, did you run a seperate wire for the tach output? The tach wire runs through or near your obd2 connector, so it may not be coming in where you think it is. Since you celica isn't obd2, the lack of this connector may be part of the problem.

I would just run a wire straight from the taco pin on the ecu to your tach signal input pin on your beams cluster if you haven't tried this already. Bypass the tach adapter.

puretone · 01-26-2007, 12:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mr220v

As near as I can tell, its a straight shot from the ecu to the tach.

When you set up you tach adapter, did you run a seperate wire for the tach output? The tach wire runs through or near your obd2 connector, so it may not be coming in where you think it is. Since you celica isn't obd2, the lack of this connector may be part of the problem.

I would just run a wire straight from the taco pin on the ecu to your tach signal input pin on your beams cluster if you haven't tried this already. Bypass the tach adapter.

yeah well bypassing the thing makes the tach not work....so you might understand why im all funfused at it lol...

oh and im nearly done wiring in the OBD2 plug and all that niftyness

mr220v · 01-26-2007, 01:04 PM

I guess for now we're all stuck buying the tach adapter. Not a huge deal.

My plan is to integrate the tach adapter with any pnp beams harness I make.

I ABSOLUTELY do not want to leave any of the wiring to the end user. This is the kiss of death. I want for any newbie to be able to do this swap reliably and still have the total cost come out around $2000 with a minimum of downtime.

I take way more responsibility for the ultimate success of a swap than some others who are doing the "wiring via mail" thing. If I can't guarantee success I won't wire it.

I have 25 4age 20v conversions operational for the mk1. Hopefully in another year, i'll be able to say the same for the beams 3sge conversion. That should make this forum more popular.

PHOENIX · 01-28-2007, 08:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mr220v

. Hopefully in another year, i'll be able to say the same for the beams 3sge conversion. That should make this forum more popular.

Stong work!

If you need the part numbers to the harness clips, let me know, i can get those to you.

mr220v · 01-29-2007, 12:59 PM

The motor is in. I used my 5s tranny, beams pressureplate and flywheel (the 3sgte flywheel is noticeably heavier) and a 5s disk.

The car turns over (thats the easy part). The issue i'm having is that i'm not getting a check engine light when the ignition is turned on (meaning ecu is not turning on). I have the typical power leads hooked up, batt and b+. I'm thinking of three possible reasons for this issue.

-dead ecu

-additional power source that I didn't wire for

-wrong ecu pinouts (there are people who say that there is a map sensored beams ecu, though i've never seen it)

All major circuits seem to be live. Injectors, coilpack, idle control, ecu, etc....
So the ecu is getting power. This would be a first, but does this ecu have to be grounded to the chasis?

TWOMANY2 · 02-05-2007, 05:38 PM

I will pull out my notes to see were I had to supply power to.
Send me a e mail with your contact info.
TWOMANY2
Mark
TWOMR2@bellsouth.net

Kev_GT · 02-07-2007, 03:46 PM

I too had this kind of problem of the car turning over but not starting!

I had to jumper the fuel rail power and the ignitor power to get it working.

I do have a celica tho i dont know if its the same on a MR 2 but i guess its the same direction.

Kev

mr220v · 02-07-2007, 04:06 PM

My problem is that i'm not getting any ecu activity at all. I have no problem turning over (thats the easy part).

When you first turn the ignition on, your check engine light comes on with it. I'm not getting this, which leads me to believe that the ecu is not functional.

Starting and running aside, just to get the ecu to power up and show activity only requires the two power supply wires (BATT and +B), the ground wires (E1, EO1, and EO2) and the warning light (W).

So, i'm down to the problem being one of three basic things:

1. Bad ecu
2. Bad ecu plug pinning (due to my error, or the pinouts not matching up with the ecu)
3. The beams ecu doesn't que the check engine light when the accessories are first turned on (this would be a first for a toyota), and everything is really ok.

WFX · 02-07-2007, 05:57 PM

For the record my engine check light doesnt come on either again dont know why so if you find out Id love to know!

mr220v · 02-07-2007, 10:44 PM

Thats very good news. So maybe my ecu isn't fubar after all.

WFX · 02-08-2007, 01:29 AM

My VVTi isnt working thou so dont get happy just yet!

Perhaps someone with a factory fitted BEAMS can confirm for us if the light does in fact come on, I only know of Primuf with his MR2!

mr220v · 02-08-2007, 09:34 AM

Its only one control wire for the warning light. Its either hooked up or it isn't.

TWOMANY2 · 02-08-2007, 10:04 AM

The light should come on
Twomany2
Mark

mr220v · 02-08-2007, 11:46 AM

One observation I made from looking at the blacktop wiring diagrams, it appears that that particular ecu does have the +b1 power input, whereas the diagram on the redtop ecu does not.

I opened up my ecu, and took a look at the pcb around pin8 on the 22pin plug where +b1 is shown to come in on the blacktop diagram. It is not an inactive pin. There is a lead coming off of it. Aside from this pin, the redtop and blacktop ecu's appear to be very similar. I'm wondering if they couldn't be used interchangeably.

So, I'll try adding power to pin8 this saturday, and see where that gets me.

01-24-2007, 01:50 PM	#1 (permalink)
mr220v Beams Owners Group Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 1,791 Thanks: 13 Thanked 139 Times in 117 Posts iTrader Rating: (9/100% )	So the beams goes in this weekend With my wife out of town, and a whole weekend at my disposal, its time to act on my 2 months of planning and wiring. I have my motor ready to go already fitted with gen3 3sgte water outlet housing and crank pulley. I plan on reusing my s54 tranny and possibly my existing clutch, flywheel, pressureplate and TO bearing. Unfortunately, the msd tach adapter was out of stock at my local shop, so i'll just have to add that later. The wiring has been taken care of as well. My harness is based off of my stock 5sfe engine harness and the cut celica beams harness I received with my engine. If all goes well, I will be able to make more of these for anybody wanting to attempt this swap later. So, aside from any grotesque wiring mistake, I should have a running beams transplant Sunday. Total costs should not exceed $1500. Pretty good for a US beams conversion.

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01-24-2007, 01:57 PM	#2 (permalink)
Edophus Beams Owners Group Join Date: Oct 2006 Posts: 275 Thanks: 7 Thanked 13 Times in 12 Posts iTrader Rating: (0/0% )	$1500 well spent! Good luck with the swap

01-24-2007, 05:47 PM	#3 (permalink)
PHOENIX Beams Owners Group Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: On Hiatus....... Posts: 7,915 Thanks: 84 Thanked 260 Times in 197 Posts Blog Entries: 1 My Google Map iTrader Rating: (46/100% )	Wow, Take lots of pictures for us! Very nice work!

01-25-2007, 09:18 AM	#5 (permalink)
mr220v Beams Owners Group Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 1,791 Thanks: 13 Thanked 139 Times in 117 Posts iTrader Rating: (9/100% )	The actual signal sent to the cluster is generated at the ecu on the beams, and other direct fire toyotas. On older toyotas, the tach signal was created by the igniter. I used the msd 8920 once before. It was on my first 20v when I was using an msd blaster. The signal would not work with my toyota tach. It seems that the beams tach signal is the more standardized type.

01-25-2007, 01:00 PM	#7 (permalink)
mr220v Beams Owners Group Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 1,791 Thanks: 13 Thanked 139 Times in 117 Posts iTrader Rating: (9/100% )	As near as I can tell, its a straight shot from the ecu to the tach. When you set up you tach adapter, did you run a seperate wire for the tach output? The tach wire runs through or near your obd2 connector, so it may not be coming in where you think it is. Since you celica isn't obd2, the lack of this connector may be part of the problem. I would just run a wire straight from the taco pin on the ecu to your tach signal input pin on your beams cluster if you haven't tried this already. Bypass the tach adapter.

01-26-2007, 01:04 PM	#9 (permalink)
mr220v Beams Owners Group Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 1,791 Thanks: 13 Thanked 139 Times in 117 Posts iTrader Rating: (9/100% )	I guess for now we're all stuck buying the tach adapter. Not a huge deal. My plan is to integrate the tach adapter with any pnp beams harness I make. I ABSOLUTELY do not want to leave any of the wiring to the end user. This is the kiss of death. I want for any newbie to be able to do this swap reliably and still have the total cost come out around $2000 with a minimum of downtime. I take way more responsibility for the ultimate success of a swap than some others who are doing the "wiring via mail" thing. If I can't guarantee success I won't wire it. I have 25 4age 20v conversions operational for the mk1. Hopefully in another year, i'll be able to say the same for the beams 3sge conversion. That should make this forum more popular.

01-29-2007, 12:59 PM	#11 (permalink)
mr220v Beams Owners Group Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 1,791 Thanks: 13 Thanked 139 Times in 117 Posts iTrader Rating: (9/100% )	The motor is in. I used my 5s tranny, beams pressureplate and flywheel (the 3sgte flywheel is noticeably heavier) and a 5s disk. The car turns over (thats the easy part). The issue i'm having is that i'm not getting a check engine light when the ignition is turned on (meaning ecu is not turning on). I have the typical power leads hooked up, batt and b+. I'm thinking of three possible reasons for this issue. -dead ecu -additional power source that I didn't wire for -wrong ecu pinouts (there are people who say that there is a map sensored beams ecu, though i've never seen it) All major circuits seem to be live. Injectors, coilpack, idle control, ecu, etc.... So the ecu is getting power. This would be a first, but does this ecu have to be grounded to the chasis?

02-05-2007, 05:38 PM	#12 (permalink)
TWOMANY2 Beams Owners Group Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Jax. , FLA Posts: 11 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post iTrader Rating: (0/0% )	I will pull out my notes to see were I had to supply power to. Send me a e mail with your contact info. TWOMANY2 Mark TWOMR2@bellsouth.net

02-07-2007, 03:46 PM	#13 (permalink)
Kev_GT Beams Owners Group Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 13 Thanks: 2 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts iTrader Rating: (0/0% )	I too had this kind of problem of the car turning over but not starting! I had to jumper the fuel rail power and the ignitor power to get it working. I do have a celica tho i dont know if its the same on a MR 2 but i guess its the same direction. Kev

02-07-2007, 04:06 PM	#14 (permalink)
mr220v Beams Owners Group Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 1,791 Thanks: 13 Thanked 139 Times in 117 Posts iTrader Rating: (9/100% )	My problem is that i'm not getting any ecu activity at all. I have no problem turning over (thats the easy part). When you first turn the ignition on, your check engine light comes on with it. I'm not getting this, which leads me to believe that the ecu is not functional. Starting and running aside, just to get the ecu to power up and show activity only requires the two power supply wires (BATT and +B), the ground wires (E1, EO1, and EO2) and the warning light (W). So, i'm down to the problem being one of three basic things: 1. Bad ecu 2. Bad ecu plug pinning (due to my error, or the pinouts not matching up with the ecu) 3. The beams ecu doesn't que the check engine light when the accessories are first turned on (this would be a first for a toyota), and everything is really ok.

02-07-2007, 05:57 PM	#15 (permalink)
WFX Beams Owners Group Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Perth, Western Australia Posts: 337 Thanks: 9 Thanked 13 Times in 10 Posts My Google Map iTrader Rating: (0/0% )	For the record my engine check light doesnt come on either again dont know why so if you find out Id love to know!

02-07-2007, 10:44 PM	#16 (permalink)
mr220v Beams Owners Group Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 1,791 Thanks: 13 Thanked 139 Times in 117 Posts iTrader Rating: (9/100% )	Thats very good news. So maybe my ecu isn't fubar after all.

02-08-2007, 01:29 AM	#17 (permalink)
WFX Beams Owners Group Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Perth, Western Australia Posts: 337 Thanks: 9 Thanked 13 Times in 10 Posts My Google Map iTrader Rating: (0/0% )	My VVTi isnt working thou so dont get happy just yet! Perhaps someone with a factory fitted BEAMS can confirm for us if the light does in fact come on, I only know of Primuf with his MR2!

02-08-2007, 09:34 AM	#18 (permalink)
mr220v Beams Owners Group Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 1,791 Thanks: 13 Thanked 139 Times in 117 Posts iTrader Rating: (9/100% )	Its only one control wire for the warning light. Its either hooked up or it isn't.

02-08-2007, 10:04 AM	#19 (permalink)
TWOMANY2 Beams Owners Group Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Jax. , FLA Posts: 11 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post iTrader Rating: (0/0% )	The light should come on Twomany2 Mark

02-08-2007, 11:46 AM	#20 (permalink)
mr220v Beams Owners Group Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 1,791 Thanks: 13 Thanked 139 Times in 117 Posts iTrader Rating: (9/100% )	One observation I made from looking at the blacktop wiring diagrams, it appears that that particular ecu does have the +b1 power input, whereas the diagram on the redtop ecu does not. I opened up my ecu, and took a look at the pcb around pin8 on the 22pin plug where +b1 is shown to come in on the blacktop diagram. It is not an inactive pin. There is a lead coming off of it. Aside from this pin, the redtop and blacktop ecu's appear to be very similar. I'm wondering if they couldn't be used interchangeably. So, I'll try adding power to pin8 this saturday, and see where that gets me.