Front end shake 50+ - Page 2

Mista 2 · 03-04-2008, 04:34 AM

hey all, i am getting the same problem and i will be looking at changing the tie rod ends and the ball joints however being in australia is a pain in the ass. i have an 85 AW11 but parts are very hard to come by. my question is, are the ball joints and tie rod end the same as the 87+? im sure my shockers are on the way out but i am having troubles finding parts for those too. i am looking at coilovers as i need bearing plates too.

any help would be gr8

thanks

Jordan
Mista 2

tjmr2 · 03-05-2008, 01:38 AM

MR2's that have had the lug nuts over torqued have a tendency to have warped disk brake rotors which can show up as steering wheel shake, brake pedal bounce - pulsing feeling or both. Tire shops are famous for over torquing lug nuts.

If you have a dial indicator put the car up on blocks and pull the wheels. Put all the lug nuts back on with a low but even torque and measure the runout of your disk's. I don't know the specification off the top of my head but they should be really close to true. The BGB or a brake shop should be able to tell you the specification.

Good Luck.

mr2tim · 04-29-2008, 04:21 PM

Yeah the BGB page a-27 has this info.

disc wheel lateral runoff max 1.2mm or 0.047 in
hub axial play " 0.05mm or 0.0020 in
ball joint vertical play " 0 0

Personnally I can tell when my tires age, some shakeing at 35-50mph.

mr2tim

AL1222 · 05-22-2008, 12:20 AM

my mr2 had the same problem, i had to replace the brake rotors and pads. the rotors were warped so thats what was causing the shake at about 50mph +

Gairloch · 05-22-2008, 04:13 AM

Warped rotors will only cause vibration under braking

feral4mr2 · 05-22-2008, 07:38 AM

the inner steering rack bush is always forgotten when people diagnose the aw11 wheel shimmy/shake @ ~100 km/ph.

another point to the steering rack bush is a slight knocking from the front end when driving slowy over rough terrain.

LokiRx7 · 05-22-2008, 11:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gairloch

Warped rotors will only cause vibration under braking

Not always, a warped rotor can cause vibration while driving. I used to think this as well, but I had a nasty shake in my '88 GT-S. I put new tires on it (they were worn anyway, I was just looking for an excuse to replace them) and had the wheels balanced. Didnt cure the problem, after awhile it got worse and I started noticing some vibration under braking, however it was hard to distinguish if it was worse under braking because it seemed to shake constantly while cruising. My Tie Rods were fine, and I usually always replace ball joints when I buy a car if the boots are ripped, a good habit to get into.

(Also on the GT-S I ruled out the axles as they had been replaced somewhat recently, the boots arent torn, and they werent making any noise)

I replaced both front rotors and it cured the problem. My MR2 had the same problem, and I even replaced the rack bushings as stated before I even tried the rotors.

Gairloch · 05-23-2008, 03:50 AM

Interesting. I didn't know that rotors could get that far out of balance. Thanks for sharing!

LokiRx7 · 05-23-2008, 02:12 PM

Well I had a feeling it was the rotors on my MR2. At least after the GT-S incident, my drivers side caliper locked up and I drove it almost a mile before I saw (or smelled) the cloud of smoke coming from the wheel well. I still had aways to go to get home and couldnt afford a tow, so I waited for the rotor to cool, and SLOWLY drove the rest of the way. So I knew at least one of the rotors was toast...

As far as the GT-S the rotors were worn past the point of being turned anymore, so I can only assume that they were a little too thin and warped badly under my hard braking (I always take the twisty roads....)

Other than those two cars I have never seen rotors get that bad. And I worked in a little hole in the wall brake service place years ago.

brantgraves · 08-25-2008, 11:19 PM

i have close to the same problem, im certain its my struts and tire balance though, its just around here it every shop charges $25 a tire to balance!!!

LokiRx7 · 08-25-2008, 11:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by brantgraves

i have close to the same problem, im certain its my struts and tire balance though, its just around here it every shop charges $25 a tire to balance!!!

I would definatley have your wheels balanced. Keep in mind the age of your tires. Old tires can have problems that cause them to be out of balance, sometimes to the point that wheel weights wont cure the problem.

$25 a tire is a little much, Wal-mart charges $7 a tire. And if you find a good tire changing place, some offer free balancing for the life of your tires (Providing you buy your tires from them obviously).

And I would have an alignment dont too, places around here generally charge $25-$35 for an alignment.

brantgraves · 09-02-2008, 03:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LokiRx7

I would definatley have your wheels balanced. Keep in mind the age of your tires. Old tires can have problems that cause them to be out of balance, sometimes to the point that wheel weights wont cure the problem.

$25 a tire is a little much, Wal-mart charges $7 a tire. And if you find a good tire changing place, some offer free balancing for the life of your tires (Providing you buy your tires from them obviously).

And I would have an alignment dont too, places around here generally charge $25-$35 for an alignment.

yeah, my tires are pretty old, i bought the car from a guy who let it sit for 5 years.. but the tires have alot of life left, so i didnt think anything about it till i noticed all these problems. $41 is the cheapest alignment in town here, but would i need a alignment even though it drives perfectly straight? and my car does have 170k on it, so im sure the struts are bad anyway...

LokiRx7 · 09-02-2008, 02:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by brantgraves

yeah, my tires are pretty old, i bought the car from a guy who let it sit for 5 years.. but the tires have alot of life left, so i didnt think anything about it till i noticed all these problems. $41 is the cheapest alignment in town here, but would i need a alignment even though it drives perfectly straight? and my car does have 170k on it, so im sure the struts are bad anyway...

Check your struts by walking to one corner of the car, push down on the bumper and bounce the car a few times. Let go really quickly while the car is moving up and down. If the car continues to bounce anymore than one more time, the struts are bad, if it seems to immediatly return to the upright position with maybe a tiny amount of bounciness, they are probably good. Go to each corner and do this. If you notice one corner is bad, then you have found that the shock nearest you is bad. My car just ticked off 150K and its shocks are still good, great in fact, I was very surprised.

I VERY recently bought an MR2 that ironically also sat for five years. It had new tires put on it.... Five years ago, they still had about 95% tread left, they looked fine other than some slight dry rot. After driving the car on the road they were all out of balance, however even having them balanced didnt help. So I had to buy all new tires, but it wasnt a loss at all, I spent the extra money and got performance tires. Best investment you can make on an MR2.

If the car drives straight, and you can inspect all the suspension components yourself, you dont really need an alignment. Sometimes shops get cars that are perfectly straight when they are put on the alignment rack. In that case, they check all the suspension pieces and make sure everything is in good condition... And they still charge for the alignment...

brantgraves · 09-02-2008, 03:02 PM

thankyou LokiRx7
i did what you said, and all the struts are bad acording to your test.......
and yeah, there is deff some dry rot on the tires, i guess i should drop some cash on tires too... any idea how much the struts/shocks should cost?

i already checked all my suspetion parts, and they seem to be perfectly fine.

LokiRx7 · 09-02-2008, 08:00 PM

The struts are about $43 a corner from Autozone, thats actually pretty cheap. They are strut inserts and they are straightforward to do yourself. Just make sure you have a very large pipe wrench. I had a big adjustable wrench, but the Advance auto parts replacements that I bought had a round top nut, and I didnt have the tool to tighten them, so I used a pipe wrench, worked pretty good. I think it needs to be an 18 inch adjustable/pipe wrench to get around that top nut to get the strut cartridges out.

Make sure the ball joint boots arent ripped, and wiggle the tie rods. When I bought my car, considering the fact it sat for five years and had no maintence records, I simply went ahead and replaced all of this along with buying polyurethane bushings to replace the worn control arm bushings. (I actually bought a Prothane Total kit) But if you dont have the money to replace it all, at least check the tie rods and ball joints.

I purchased Bridgestone Fusion Tires for my car (I personally use ZRI's but I have aftermarket wheels. The OEM wheel size only comes in HRIs, but I have used those as well.) The Fuzions are DIRT cheap, and worth every penny, they arent the best tire you can buy. But in they're price range they are the best. I think the ZRI's are near Potenza grip, for the price of an all season tire. The HRI's are excellent too, they cost $47 per tire, and come with an H speed rating, they are very quiet, and will grip a hell of a lot better than any other tire for the price.

It seems overwhelming now, but when you are finished, it is SOOOOO worth it, trust me!

05-22-2008, 04:13 AM	#25 (permalink)
Gairloch Dreaming of apexes Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Minneapolis, MN Posts: 4,848 Thanks: 125 Thanked 258 Times in 228 Posts My Google Map iTrader Rating: (7/100% )	Warped rotors will only cause vibration under braking __________________ "Inside the car, the world beyond the driver's immediate horizon ceases to exist. Alone with the solitude of his desire, survival sense numbed by the speed, he's outrun the mediocrity of the outside world, slipped the shackles it tries to clamp on us all. He is running free, chased only by a fear of failure, for failure is to risk ejection into the real world." ~Mark Hughes

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03-04-2008, 04:34 AM	#21 (permalink)
Mista 2 Cage Fighter Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Adelaide, Australia Posts: 461 Thanks: 16 Thanked 21 Times in 21 Posts My Google Map iTrader Rating: (0/0% )	hey all, i am getting the same problem and i will be looking at changing the tie rod ends and the ball joints however being in australia is a pain in the ass. i have an 85 AW11 but parts are very hard to come by. my question is, are the ball joints and tie rod end the same as the 87+? im sure my shockers are on the way out but i am having troubles finding parts for those too. i am looking at coilovers as i need bearing plates too. any help would be gr8 thanks Jordan Mista 2

03-05-2008, 01:38 AM	#22 (permalink)
tjmr2 Cage Fighter Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Colorado Posts: 310 Thanks: 0 Thanked 49 Times in 46 Posts My Google Map iTrader Rating: (0/0% )	MR2's that have had the lug nuts over torqued have a tendency to have warped disk brake rotors which can show up as steering wheel shake, brake pedal bounce - pulsing feeling or both. Tire shops are famous for over torquing lug nuts. If you have a dial indicator put the car up on blocks and pull the wheels. Put all the lug nuts back on with a low but even torque and measure the runout of your disk's. I don't know the specification off the top of my head but they should be really close to true. The BGB or a brake shop should be able to tell you the specification. Good Luck.

04-29-2008, 04:21 PM	#23 (permalink)
mr2tim SUPERcharZed ToyZ RacZer Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: South Florida Posts: 690 Thanks: 2 Thanked 41 Times in 38 Posts My Google Map iTrader Rating: (2/100% )	Yeah the BGB page a-27 has this info. disc wheel lateral runoff max 1.2mm or 0.047 in hub axial play " 0.05mm or 0.0020 in ball joint vertical play " 0 0 Personnally I can tell when my tires age, some shakeing at 35-50mph. mr2tim

05-22-2008, 12:20 AM	#24 (permalink)
AL1222 Some Skills Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 55 Thanks: 3 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts iTrader Rating: (1/100% )	my mr2 had the same problem, i had to replace the brake rotors and pads. the rotors were warped so thats what was causing the shake at about 50mph +

05-22-2008, 07:38 AM	#26 (permalink)
feral4mr2 ghetto modder Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Western Australia Posts: 128 Thanks: 0 Thanked 10 Times in 10 Posts iTrader Rating: (1/100% )	the inner steering rack bush is always forgotten when people diagnose the aw11 wheel shimmy/shake @ ~100 km/ph. another point to the steering rack bush is a slight knocking from the front end when driving slowy over rough terrain.

05-23-2008, 03:50 AM	#28 (permalink)
Gairloch Dreaming of apexes Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Minneapolis, MN Posts: 4,848 Thanks: 125 Thanked 258 Times in 228 Posts My Google Map iTrader Rating: (7/100% )	Interesting. I didn't know that rotors could get that far out of balance. Thanks for sharing!

05-23-2008, 02:12 PM	#29 (permalink)
LokiRx7 MR2 + Flat Black = FAIL Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: N.C. Ohio Posts: 315 Thanks: 0 Thanked 15 Times in 14 Posts iTrader Rating: (1/100% )	Well I had a feeling it was the rotors on my MR2. At least after the GT-S incident, my drivers side caliper locked up and I drove it almost a mile before I saw (or smelled) the cloud of smoke coming from the wheel well. I still had aways to go to get home and couldnt afford a tow, so I waited for the rotor to cool, and SLOWLY drove the rest of the way. So I knew at least one of the rotors was toast... As far as the GT-S the rotors were worn past the point of being turned anymore, so I can only assume that they were a little too thin and warped badly under my hard braking (I always take the twisty roads....) Other than those two cars I have never seen rotors get that bad. And I worked in a little hole in the wall brake service place years ago.

08-25-2008, 11:19 PM	#30 (permalink)
brantgraves i wanna slide it! Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: wichita Posts: 42 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts iTrader Rating: (0/0% )	i have close to the same problem, im certain its my struts and tire balance though, its just around here it every shop charges $25 a tire to balance!!!

09-02-2008, 03:02 PM	#34 (permalink)
brantgraves i wanna slide it! Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: wichita Posts: 42 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts iTrader Rating: (0/0% )	thankyou LokiRx7 i did what you said, and all the struts are bad acording to your test....... and yeah, there is deff some dry rot on the tires, i guess i should drop some cash on tires too... any idea how much the struts/shocks should cost? i already checked all my suspetion parts, and they seem to be perfectly fine.

09-02-2008, 08:00 PM	#35 (permalink)
LokiRx7 MR2 + Flat Black = FAIL Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: N.C. Ohio Posts: 315 Thanks: 0 Thanked 15 Times in 14 Posts iTrader Rating: (1/100% )	The struts are about $43 a corner from Autozone, thats actually pretty cheap. They are strut inserts and they are straightforward to do yourself. Just make sure you have a very large pipe wrench. I had a big adjustable wrench, but the Advance auto parts replacements that I bought had a round top nut, and I didnt have the tool to tighten them, so I used a pipe wrench, worked pretty good. I think it needs to be an 18 inch adjustable/pipe wrench to get around that top nut to get the strut cartridges out. Make sure the ball joint boots arent ripped, and wiggle the tie rods. When I bought my car, considering the fact it sat for five years and had no maintence records, I simply went ahead and replaced all of this along with buying polyurethane bushings to replace the worn control arm bushings. (I actually bought a Prothane Total kit) But if you dont have the money to replace it all, at least check the tie rods and ball joints. I purchased Bridgestone Fusion Tires for my car (I personally use ZRI's but I have aftermarket wheels. The OEM wheel size only comes in HRIs, but I have used those as well.) The Fuzions are DIRT cheap, and worth every penny, they arent the best tire you can buy. But in they're price range they are the best. I think the ZRI's are near Potenza grip, for the price of an all season tire. The HRI's are excellent too, they cost $47 per tire, and come with an H speed rating, they are very quiet, and will grip a hell of a lot better than any other tire for the price. It seems overwhelming now, but when you are finished, it is SOOOOO worth it, trust me!