1zz or 20v?

[U-235]

I accidentally got into this dilemma in another section as we drifted off topic...

But here's what I'm looking at. I'm tossing the idea of a 20v or 1ZZ into a mk1 for the sole purpose of building a meatier commuter. I want more than stock power, which obviously either engine will provide. My overall goal is to see how much I can improve the fuel economy over the stock mk1 specs, as well as have a reliable/low maintenance platform. Basically, I opinions of (1) which engine should I use and (2) why? How much could I extend my range with an aftermarket EMS and tunes or an ECU flash of some kind?

Things to consider:

-swap complexity is a minimal issue. Unless you're going to suggest Prius internals. Not gonna happen. =p
-project must cost less than 4000USD.
-My commuting route is NOT VERY conducive to having a manual transmission, so I'm fairly adament on using an AT (I have a mk2 with a stick that's my fun car). Knowing if any newer transmission/axle combos would work aside from the stock AT/axles would be greatly appreciated.

Purpose: mostly, for the sake of doing a swap. However, my goal is to try and squeeze +42mpg out of it. I chose the mk1, other than being win and awesome, for it's lightweight, making it an ideal candidate. And, it will bring down my insurance by over 100USD/mo (my '98 Integra is KILLING me. Sorta).

Alternatives: I've also looked at the Toyota 'C' type engines (for diesel), however, they're a wee bit sparse without ordering a full Corolla front clip from Japan and ultimately... Overbudget, lol. But if any of you have other ideas, I'd be happy to hear them.

Target date to start swap is March-April of '08.

[U-235]

Aww... No one wants to help with the longest range MK1 IN THE WORLD? Or something.

Hmm... I wonder how lean I could run a silver top...

[mr220v]

You could do a 5afe and really see how far it will go.

There is also the 1azfse. Direct injection. Would be a bit of a pain to get into an mr2, but would probably be pretty cheap. Aftermarket tuning would also be tough.

20v would be hard pressed to get past 40mpg, though its not impossible. 1zz would get it for sure and on 87 octane.

[U-235]

Originally Posted by mr220v

You could do a 5afe and really see how far it will go.

There is also the 1azfse. Direct injection. Would be a bit of a pain to get into an mr2, but would probably be pretty cheap. Aftermarket tuning would also be tough.

20v would be hard pressed to get past 40mpg, though its not impossible. 1zz would get it for sure and on 87 octane.

Yeah, I was confident about the 1zz doing it, but I was looking strongly at the 20v for it's overall simplicity- I just wasn't sure of the economy.

But more importantly... Do you know which auto-transmission/drive shaft combos would work for the MR2 other than the stock? I'd like to use a newer tranny if I could...

[mr220v]

I would imagine that you can use any automatic transmission from an A series motor. I know some of the newer ones were 4speed, so might not be able to use the mr2's control module.

Fuel economy wise, the 20v is about the same as the 16v. Maybe a little better, but nothing major. You'll also have to run higher octane gas.

You could try running a taller 5th gear. You could do this with your 16v too.

[U-235]

Originally Posted by mr220v

I would imagine that you can use any automatic transmission from an A series motor. I know some of the newer ones were 4speed, so might not be able to use the mr2's control module.

Fuel economy wise, the 20v is about the same as the 16v. Maybe a little better, but nothing major. You'll also have to run higher octane gas.

You could try running a taller 5th gear. You could do this with your 16v too.

Thanks. But about the transmissions, I just wasn't sure which ones the MR2 shafts would work with.

However, I believe that I may end up with a 5-speed. It seems that what you suggested- building a taller 5th gear- is the *best* way to improve gas mileage on the cheap.

So, on that note, if one wanted to avoid the hassles of converting a C56 to accomodate the MR2 layout, is it possible to cram the internals into the C52 box? I think I read somewhere on the board here that it is, but I just wanted to make sure.

[mr220v]

Eric's Paddock

This site has the details of converting the various transmissions. With a c56, it would be a bit easier to use the center casing from you mr2's c5x.

[AustinTxMR2]

Originally Posted by U-235

building a taller 5th gear- is the *best* way to improve gas mileage on the cheap.

I'm interested in this thread also. I like my 86 mk1 as a daily...economy is good, Driving in stop and go traffic is a pain with a 5 speed.

1zz sounds like a better and better option all the time. Buddy of mine totaled a 04 corrolla about 2 years ago and I wish I'd been thinking about this back then as he would have got it back from insurance for me.

Final drive ratio on my 86 is 3.54 to 1. last 3 fillups came to 37.8mpg,42.4mpg and 40.3mpg.

I sure would like a little more power AND economy! John

[mr220v]

I could probably do a custom engine harness for anybody intrested in a 1zz swap. It'd be a little more than the 20v, say $450 instead of $350.

85-86 cars would need the ecu relocated to the opposite side of the trunk.

[U-235]

Originally Posted by mr220v

I could probably do a custom engine harness for anybody intrested in a 1zz swap. It'd be a little more than the 20v, say $450 instead of $350.

85-86 cars would need the ecu relocated to the opposite side of the trunk.

/shameless plug. =p

lol, just kidding. That would certainly make the swap easier, though... Then a little bit of fab work would really just be what was less on the 'big' side of the project.

Provided I ever get my damn V6 mk2 off the drawing board and onto the road. =(