Do I Need To Switch The ECU

Aquarius · 04-23-2006, 01:09 AM

Do I need to switch the ECU when putting a 5 spd in placed of the at tranny if 5 spd is same year as car and also out of a SC? Also are SC trannys different than na's? Found some info, but just wasn't clear about it.

PHOENIX · 04-23-2006, 01:14 AM

yes, you will need to swich ECU's if going from an Auto tranny to a manual tranny.

CpuZapper · 04-24-2006, 11:45 AM

The NA tranny is different than the SC. The NAs had either C-50 or C-52 depending on the year. The C-52 has two nubs for the starter, one on either side, as it can be used in a FWD. The SC had an E-51 which, from what I'm told is basically all the internals of an E-153 MKII Turbo tranny, in a different case. I know that they are significantly heavier than the NAs, and will hold more power but have slightly different mounts, require different axles, and different clutches. If you have an automatic in your car, you will need a MT ECU, all the clutch plumbing and hardware, clutch, axles, etc.

TheAmazingDave · 04-24-2006, 12:06 PM

I use an automatic ECU on my GZE swap. The car runs great, but I find it runs best with a 91/100 octane blend, I don't know why that is so but I speculate that it isn't seeing a signal from the tranny letting it know it's in gear and the timing system isn't working properly. Or maybe I just have a lot of carbon build-up, as it does have a lot of miles on it...

I noticed on 4A-GEs that the ECU is actually marked as A/T or M/T. No such markings are on the ECU of my 4A-GZE. At the time of the swap, I figured that the ECU would notice the tranny controller computer was missing in run in manual mode.

CpuZapper · 04-24-2006, 11:21 PM

Hmm... good point. In that case, I have no clue... Just do it and see if it works, then let us know. Hehehe... you get to be gunea pig!

pckrckt · 08-13-2007, 11:54 PM

on the 4AGZE you can run either ECU, I have both, and used both, and could not tell the difference.

TheAmazingDave · 08-16-2007, 11:01 PM

double-post, I'm an idiot...

TheAmazingDave · 08-16-2007, 11:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pckrckt

on the 4AGZE you can run either ECU, I have both, and used both, and could not tell the difference.

Do you have any proof besides you can't "feel" the difference? It's better tp produce a dyno chart or something, perhaps a verified part number comparison...

Without such proof, it's better to err on the side of caution than to make general assumptions.

As I mentioned, I use an Automatic ECU on my GZE swap, and the timing does not work properly. If your timing is already off, this could cause a serious problem. I have to run 100 octane, and shouldn't have to, to keep away from detonation with my Nevo pulley.

pckrckt · 08-16-2007, 11:22 PM

I don't have to have dyno charts, I was merely saying that the car will run with either ECU. I'm not claiming one makes the car run better than the other. Other than video taping me swap ECUs, and going for a drive, I can't feel anything operating abnormal in the engine compartment.
Now, I have here sitting on my desk both ECUs

The 5 speed ECU part number is 89661-17130 with red 4AGZE letters

The Automatic ECU part number 89661-17120 with green 4AGZE letters

My engine is completely stock, but it was blueprinted, balanced, with most components brand new. I run premium gas all the time, but it's just out of habit.

Not confirmed, but I heard once that the only differences between SC ECUs, was that the automatic ECU does not have a rev limiter.

TheAmazingDave · 08-16-2007, 11:37 PM

That is false, the rev limiter is in full effect spot on at 7,500. I'm glad to see the same part numbers, but the colors of the letters do indicate a difference.

Not doubting it will run, and run fine, with both ECUs, I just wish we could get some concrete info on the difference.

ninja-edit: I recently purchased a new GZE from a manual car with the matchin ECU. I am going to be installing it soon enough, I'll see if it effects the timing.

mr2tim · 04-24-2008, 10:57 PM

I'm not real hot on this techno stuff but the BGB page Fl-31 shows an id of the ecu connectors/output....

Perhaps the discussion should be "Engine revolution sensor" vs."ECT computer" and go from there? Does the harness change?

I've got 4 shifter cars whaata i know?

Didn't mean to butt in.

04-23-2006, 01:09 AM	#1 (permalink)
Aquarius Some Skills Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: So. Cal Posts: 40 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts iTrader Rating: (0/0% )	Do I Need To Switch The ECU Do I need to switch the ECU when putting a 5 spd in placed of the at tranny if 5 spd is same year as car and also out of a SC? Also are SC trannys different than na's? Found some info, but just wasn't clear about it.

04-23-2006, 01:14 AM	#2 (permalink)
PHOENIX Beams Owners Group Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: On Hiatus....... Posts: 7,915 Thanks: 84 Thanked 260 Times in 197 Posts Blog Entries: 1 My Google Map iTrader Rating: (46/100% )	yes, you will need to swich ECU's if going from an Auto tranny to a manual tranny. __________________ - Dave Phoenix is finally back on the road with new suspension pieces, god she feels good!

08-16-2007, 11:01 PM	#7 (permalink)
TheAmazingDave Cage Fighter Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: San Jose, CA Posts: 1,112 Thanks: 14 Thanked 7 Times in 7 Posts My Google Map iTrader Rating: (0/0% )	double-post, I'm an idiot... Last edited by TheAmazingDave; 08-16-2007 at 11:40 PM.

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04-24-2006, 11:45 AM	#3 (permalink)
CpuZapper RallyRacer Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Portland, OR Posts: 480 Thanks: 7 Thanked 25 Times in 22 Posts My Google Map iTrader Rating: (1/100% )	The NA tranny is different than the SC. The NAs had either C-50 or C-52 depending on the year. The C-52 has two nubs for the starter, one on either side, as it can be used in a FWD. The SC had an E-51 which, from what I'm told is basically all the internals of an E-153 MKII Turbo tranny, in a different case. I know that they are significantly heavier than the NAs, and will hold more power but have slightly different mounts, require different axles, and different clutches. If you have an automatic in your car, you will need a MT ECU, all the clutch plumbing and hardware, clutch, axles, etc.

04-24-2006, 12:06 PM	#4 (permalink)
TheAmazingDave Cage Fighter Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: San Jose, CA Posts: 1,112 Thanks: 14 Thanked 7 Times in 7 Posts My Google Map iTrader Rating: (0/0% )	I use an automatic ECU on my GZE swap. The car runs great, but I find it runs best with a 91/100 octane blend, I don't know why that is so but I speculate that it isn't seeing a signal from the tranny letting it know it's in gear and the timing system isn't working properly. Or maybe I just have a lot of carbon build-up, as it does have a lot of miles on it... I noticed on 4A-GEs that the ECU is actually marked as A/T or M/T. No such markings are on the ECU of my 4A-GZE. At the time of the swap, I figured that the ECU would notice the tranny controller computer was missing in run in manual mode.

04-24-2006, 11:21 PM	#5 (permalink)
CpuZapper RallyRacer Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Portland, OR Posts: 480 Thanks: 7 Thanked 25 Times in 22 Posts My Google Map iTrader Rating: (1/100% )	Hmm... good point. In that case, I have no clue... Just do it and see if it works, then let us know. Hehehe... you get to be gunea pig!

08-13-2007, 11:54 PM	#6 (permalink)
pckrckt No Skills Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 13 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts iTrader Rating: (0/0% )	on the 4AGZE you can run either ECU, I have both, and used both, and could not tell the difference.

08-16-2007, 11:22 PM	#9 (permalink)
pckrckt No Skills Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 13 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts iTrader Rating: (0/0% )	I don't have to have dyno charts, I was merely saying that the car will run with either ECU. I'm not claiming one makes the car run better than the other. Other than video taping me swap ECUs, and going for a drive, I can't feel anything operating abnormal in the engine compartment. Now, I have here sitting on my desk both ECUs The 5 speed ECU part number is 89661-17130 with red 4AGZE letters The Automatic ECU part number 89661-17120 with green 4AGZE letters My engine is completely stock, but it was blueprinted, balanced, with most components brand new. I run premium gas all the time, but it's just out of habit. Not confirmed, but I heard once that the only differences between SC ECUs, was that the automatic ECU does not have a rev limiter.

08-16-2007, 11:37 PM	#10 (permalink)
TheAmazingDave Cage Fighter Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: San Jose, CA Posts: 1,112 Thanks: 14 Thanked 7 Times in 7 Posts My Google Map iTrader Rating: (0/0% )	That is false, the rev limiter is in full effect spot on at 7,500. I'm glad to see the same part numbers, but the colors of the letters do indicate a difference. Not doubting it will run, and run fine, with both ECUs, I just wish we could get some concrete info on the difference. ninja-edit: I recently purchased a new GZE from a manual car with the matchin ECU. I am going to be installing it soon enough, I'll see if it effects the timing.

04-24-2008, 10:57 PM	#11 (permalink)
mr2tim SUPERcharZed ToyZ RacZer Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: South Florida Posts: 690 Thanks: 2 Thanked 41 Times in 38 Posts My Google Map iTrader Rating: (2/100% )	I'm not real hot on this techno stuff but the BGB page Fl-31 shows an id of the ecu connectors/output.... Perhaps the discussion should be "Engine revolution sensor" vs."ECT computer" and go from there? Does the harness change? I've got 4 shifter cars whaata i know? Didn't mean to butt in.