Clutch whine

[dirocyn]

My 86 MR2 has started making a weird whining noise whenever I push in the clutch, it seems to be engine speed related, and goes away when I let the clutch back out. I'm guessing that's the throwout bearing. Now the questions--what bad thing is about to happen to my car? Is there anything I can do about it short of replacing the clutch/throwout bearing? How long is it likely to last, before it becomes undrivable, and what symptoms should I be watching for?

[tjmr2]

The throwout bearing is about all that can make the noise you describe while pushing in the clutch. If it siezes (binds up) it will just rub on the pressure plate causing the two to possibly weld together, or at the very least overheat the pressure plate springs. In short nothing good.

How long will it last? Impossible question to answer, remember Murphy is a bastard and will guarantee total failure featuring massive expense at the most inconvenient time.

While you have it apart replace the throw out bearing, pressure plate, disk and have the flywheel turned. I'd recommend new bolts when you reinstall the flywheel to the crankshaft. I'm using a stock (Toyota) pressure plate and disk for the 89 with my Black Top and haven't had any issues with it.

In my opinion of the parts I won't compromise quality on these are at the top of the list. I don't like pulling the engine enough to try and save a couple of dollars getting clutch parts from discount parts houses.

Good Luck!

[Jackstand Queen]

I've had really good luck with ACT brand clutches.

I've had really, really BAD luck with any clutch the local parts store throws at you as an OEM replacement.

In agreement with Tjmr2: the noise is almost certainly a throw out bearing issue.

[dirocyn]

Funds are tight right now so I'm just driving on it. It has, once or twice, made a real nasty high-pitched squeal, so I guess it's getting worse. But I'm still going, and it's been doing this for a month now. So for anybody else, I guess--when your throwout bearing starts making noise, it can keep going for at least a month. I'll post again when I either (a) fix it or (b) break down.

[palos]

You could change gears without using the clutch, though that is an art that is hard to master.

[potatoe]

its not that hard. the syncros in my vw bug are almost completely shot and i can still shift with no clutch.

[85silverna]

Anyone know where the shift points are to do that? Just for giggles n stuff

[Sh0ty]

You just kinda have to get the hang of it. Generally you can follow a rule like:
5th is x revs lower than 4th, 4th is x lower than 3rd etc etc.

[328FTW]

Originally Posted by 85silverna

Anyone know where the shift points are to do that? Just for giggles n stuff

I do from my racecar, its 7000rpm in 1st skip the clutch and rip it through, in 2nd its 7000rpm skip the clutch and rip it through, in 3rd its 7000rpm ........

[mr3]

Thats the only way to do it. Thats how I used to ride my little dirt bikes and others. I didn't have a clutch cable on half of them and just rode without. It's easier to take off on a bike without a clutch than it is a car. haha

[palos]

And for those with the expertise, explain the process for shifting down without grinding the gears.

[328FTW]

Originally Posted by palos

And for those with the expertise, explain the process for shifting down without grinding the gears.

Depends I have 2 ways, double de-clutching and the aforementioned ripping it through the gears they can't grind if you don't give them the time to do it

I actually double the clutch a lot in my road car its syncros are gone as of about 4 years ago when I built it. I do it in my race car coming into a part called the washout as well which requires precision rather than all out speed so I ease it into the corner heel toeing the gear down to 2nd.

[palos]

Double clutching isn't the preferred option as dirocyns' difficulty appears to be a throw out bearing going bad.

I rarely watch Nascar racing, but a few weeks ago at Infineon (aka Sears Point), only one of the racers highlighted was shifting sans clutch both up and down.

Guess what, I was being sarcastic, hence the word "could" was underlined.

If you can help dirocyn, please explain how to shift gears without benefit of the clutch and without damaging the syncros and the transmission in general.

[328FTW]

There is but one way, practice and knowing your car. All you are doing is blipping the throttle to rev match and trying to "slide" it in without the dogteeth bouncing. Its like trying to explain how to drive like a pro there is only one way, to try it yourself and practice.

[dirocyn]

It is a sad day. The whining throwout bearing has become a seized and squealing throwout bearing, and now the car won't run at idle with the clutch pressed in. I got it home by revving the engine up to 2500 when I clutched into first, and then shifted without clutching. I made it home, but I can't keep driving like this. So, from the time it started making noise, I made it about 2 and a half months, your mileaage may vary.

During that time, the noise with the clutch disengaged has grown steadily louder. A month ago I could hear the clutch whirring with the clutch out in neutral. By today, I can hear it in 4th gear, over the sound of the engine. I definitely need a new clutch and throwout bearing, but it will have to wait for the money to come in. In the meantime, I'm going to start looking for an inexpensive c52 transmission--so I can solve 5th gear popout while I'm at it. I am sad, because I'll be without my Two for at least a couple of weeks. But I've known this was coming, and I have another vehicle to drive until I get it fixed.

[mr2tim]

Yes, it's a sad day when the car moans for help.

Screaming in pain, I'm glad to hear you gave it a "time out".

I understand tj's advice, it's valid, but if you are budgeted and can't make those expensive replacement price expeditures, well, as a budget racer I've been there and done that.
And still won the race the next damn weekend.!

You've not had problems with the pressure plate? Leave it be.
*Mark it and the pressure plate and put them on EXACTLY in the same position as you took it off. Real important!! (Don't unbolt the flywheel)
(There is strict retightening sequences and torgues, you MUST follow!!See BGB)

Inspect that disc REAL close bro, look for hairline cracks eminanting from the hub outwards and across the spring recess holes. Those holes in the face of the disc can be used just like the tread bars on your tires to judge wear. If the rivets still look like they are embedded and not close to the wear surface of the disc, you can keep it.
(Toyota minimums are 0.3mm?)

Since you punished the dying throw-out bearing you need to look closely to the components they may have affected:
1. the tranny output spline-check it for worn sections at the end (with your fingers crossed)
2. Release Fork-this is a sloppy hanging arm that may not have neccessarily been damaged but you never know?

Lightly grease the interior of the new throw-brg, (use an alignment spline tool!) and re-grease the arm.

Now I'm not saying using precise measurement tools and such are appropriate to judge bad parts, but, if you can only afford your labor why bother?

BTW don't buy the cheapest throw-out bearing but the middle-priced one should be acceptable.

One thing I'd like to add--
Good News--you can pull the tranny without pulling the engine
Bad News--you have to pull the crank pulley off for clearance to tilt the engine on the front motor mount.

(Use jackstands!or I'll tell your mom)

Have fun,
there's no better pride than having completed a major repair on your own.

Supercharzed Toyz
A Toyota Race Team since 1989