BT VS ST VS GZE???

traintech86 · 08-03-2009, 04:43 AM

i want to know which engine would be best to get put in my 2. i am going to pay a shop to do the work so i dun have to worry about how hard it is. as for cost, within reason its not as big of an option. i wanna hear you people argue it out heh.

Papo J · 08-03-2009, 08:30 AM

GZE hands down, much more usable power than any of the others and much more room to grow out of the box. Ditch the SC, install a small turbo and you can make from about 175 to low 200whp with OEM electronics.
BTW, what shop is doing the work for you?

mr220v · 08-03-2009, 09:35 AM

I don't know about more usable, but more overall power potential for sure.

traintech86 · 08-03-2009, 12:43 PM

a shop called MRD Auto. they seem to know a bit of what they are talking about but i am no expert either. if anyone in here knows anything about them i'd love to hear more. its a lot of money and i wouldn't want to give it to the wrong person. also i kinda like my 2 so i dun want it ruined >>

mr220v · 08-03-2009, 12:46 PM

You might just ask them which swap they would be most comfortable doing. Nearly any shop should be able to do a usdm GZE swap if they are provided with complete wiring harnesses. The 20v you'll want to qualify with them more.

Papo J · 08-03-2009, 10:02 PM

Are you buying the swap and having them install it? I never heard about millennium doing any MK1 MR2 work. If you're buying the swap and just need someone to install it I know of a couple of other places you can call and get estimates also. If you get a GZE set from an MR2 and it comes complete with wiring and electronics you can do the swap in a day.

Jackstand Queen · 08-03-2009, 10:58 PM

I'd race a BT, or ST for pinks. And make the 20v owner drive the car to my house.

mr220v · 08-04-2009, 09:50 AM

You know, you left out the various S series motor options. All it takes to beat the best A series motor's stock output is a $500 gen3 3sge.

You might not want to deal with the mounting problems, but the more I look at it, the easier it seems to be, and the more I'm considering it for my car.

A 2zzge looks promising as well. Pricey though.

traintech86 · 08-04-2009, 01:38 PM

i talked to them about doing a swap before i even bought the car just to get an estimate, i forget for what engine but he def wanted a bit. they sound like a reputable company and seem to know what their talking about. unless anyone posts some bad expiriences i will be hauling my car over there tomarrow. just called the guy and he said he would rather not do it today cause there are crack heads around that like to steal batteries. i was thinkin about that $200 optima i just bought so we're gonna wait till tomarrow haha.

as for the 3 series motors, i was looking at the 3sgte and it seemed like a pain in the ass to install. granted they are installing it but i still want a reliable car too and i don't want things to be so complicated that there are problems. this kinda worries me about the a-gze, how reliable is the supercharger on it? my 4a-ge seems rock solid but i dun know about the gze. testomonials? and i am still undecided as to what engine but i am leaning gze.

Papo J · 08-04-2009, 06:05 PM

The GZE is as reliable as the AGE if it hasn't been abused. Are you supplying the newer GZE or are they getting it for you? They're not a bad shop from what I've heard but I don't know of any MK1s they've worked on. The swap into your 89 should be plug and play for the most part.

traintech86 · 08-04-2009, 07:27 PM

you're from the VA area? i am not sure who is getting the engine yet. my OD is a bit under 200k and since my engine seems to run fine i want to keep it till 200 and then do the swap. but i want to be prepared for it you know?

Papo J · 08-04-2009, 10:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by traintech86

you're from the VA area? i am not sure who is getting the engine yet. my OD is a bit under 200k and since my engine seems to run fine i want to keep it till 200 and then do the swap. but i want to be prepared for it you know?

Yes, I'm in Williamsburg. We should talk before you commit to anything with any shop. Do you know where the Langley speedway is in Hampton? If you do, try to stop by tomorrow night, they have the 1 on 1 racing series and there is a local SC MK1 that has been running there and kicking butt, I'll be there if it doesn't rain. I'll PM you my number later.

Jackstand Queen · 08-05-2009, 10:50 AM

4agze downers

Factory support for the SC itself, and many SC model specific parts has ceased.

The 4age will run pretty good, with minor tuning problems, and other small glitches. The 4agze is more intolerant of all sorts of tuning issues. They are more work to keep in tune.

This is a tranny issue, but if you have only an SC tranny to work with: there is no rebuilt, or new passenger side axle available. You can only buy a used one, or mail out a worn out one out of state for re-manufacturing.

My vote for the 4agze still stands. . . . . BT's and ST's line up, I want to win your car's title in a race.

mr220v · 08-05-2009, 11:18 AM

^I have something else I'm building for our "title race". It's a 1994 firebird with a 2008 LY6. That's the motor out of a current Silverado. 400hp and 400ft/lbs stock. 500-600hp with just a cam. 1000hp+ with a trunk mounted turbocharger.

Overall, the car will weigh about as much as a supra. Total assembly cost will be right around $5000 including the cost of the car.....and it could have been done cheaper.

I know some people on this board would have a problem with an American car, but this is by far the best way to go faster for cheaper. The only thing Toyota has that would be comparable, that's relatively easy and cost effective, is an early 80's supra or cressida with a 2jzgte. The one's I've wired are extremely fast. 300hp and 2800lbs is not bad. 1/2jzgte's are pretty cheap.

Overall, a 20v won't stand up to a modded 4agze, and turboing a 20v is not cheap, but again, if the goal is to build the ultimate drag car, you probably should reconsider using an mr2 in the first place.

Jackstand Queen · 08-05-2009, 12:00 PM

It's ridiculous to think that a heavy (for a 2 seat car), 1.6 liter car can ever compete with a 600 HP muscle type car on the dragstrip.

I'd only compete against similarly small engined cars.

I like the looks of the early 90's Firebirds. With some suspension mods, and wider tires they handle turns and curves well enough to surprise the heck out this forum's readership.

A pair of aftermarket upgrade cams for an MR2, and a stand alone EMS to run the cams could easily cost a couple thousand. A couple of thousand could go so much further on a Firebird. Mr2 upgrades are high priced is all I'm saying.

Somebody must have had their "out of the Mr2 box thinking hat on".

mr220v · 08-05-2009, 12:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jackstand Queen

Somebody must have had their "out of the Mr2 box thinking hat on".

I do wiring for lots of people's different projects, so I always have my "out of the mr2 box" thinking hat on.

It's just when I mod my cars, I keep this idea in the back of my head. I don't have the goal of making the 8 second mr2. I'm more concerned with making enough power to make the car more fun while keeping costs inline.

Right now I'm planning a beams of some sort into my mk1. 3sgte's will walk away from it in terms of power, but I don't think I want a 300hp mk1 anyway. 220-240 without lag would be awesome.

In the case of this thread, if it's close as far as which way to go, I would look around locally at what deals are there to be had. If there's a GZE, BT, or ST at an absolute steal, then that might steer me one way or another.

If you're in Atlanta, I know of an importer with a couple of DLI GZE's and all he wants is $650. Cut wiring of course. Very clean internally.

DCKilla · 08-05-2009, 01:03 PM

I would think that a mk1 BEAMS up against a stock mk2 turbo would be a pretty good drag race. On the track the mk1 BEAMS would out perform that same mk2. I haven't seen it done, but wouldn't be suprised.

mr220v · 08-05-2009, 04:29 PM

USDM and totally unmodified, I think a beams mk2 probably takes the 3sgte. Less weight and no lag. Same stock hp.

XJoshua · 08-05-2009, 10:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mr220v

^I have something else I'm building for our "title race". It's a 1994 firebird with a 2008 LY6. That's the motor out of a current Silverado. 400hp and 400ft/lbs stock. 500-600hp with just a cam. 1000hp+ with a trunk mounted turbocharger.

Overall, the car will weigh about as much as a supra. Total assembly cost will be right around $5000 including the cost of the car.....and it could have been done cheaper.

I know some people on this board would have a problem with an American car, but this is by far the best way to go faster for cheaper. The only thing Toyota has that would be comparable, that's relatively easy and cost effective, is an early 80's supra or cressida with a 2jzgte. The one's I've wired are extremely fast. 300hp and 2800lbs is not bad. 1/2jzgte's are pretty cheap.

Overall, a 20v won't stand up to a modded 4agze, and turboing a 20v is not cheap, but again, if the goal is to build the ultimate drag car, you probably should reconsider using an mr2 in the first place.

Haha MA60 and MX73 for life. I miss my Cressida :'( Im sharing this little post with the ToyCress boys, they'll get a kick.

traintech86 · 08-08-2009, 05:09 PM

how much is needed to beams up a mk1?

View Poll Results: What engine to put in?
Why ditch the 4A-GE?	6	14.63%
20V BT	11	26.83%
20V ST	3	7.32%
4A-GZE	21	51.22%
Voters: 41. You may not vote on this poll

08-03-2009, 04:43 AM	#1 (permalink)
traintech86 Cage Fighter Join Date: May 2009 Location: Yokosuka, Kanagawa Japan Posts: 1,802 Thanks: 27 Thanked 47 Times in 43 Posts My Google Map iTrader Rating: (3/100% )	BT VS ST VS GZE??? i want to know which engine would be best to get put in my 2. i am going to pay a shop to do the work so i dun have to worry about how hard it is. as for cost, within reason its not as big of an option. i wanna hear you people argue it out heh.

08-05-2009, 11:18 AM	#14 (permalink)
mr220v Beams Owners Group Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 2,529 Thanks: 13 Thanked 176 Times in 147 Posts iTrader Rating: (11/100% )	^I have something else I'm building for our "title race". It's a 1994 firebird with a 2008 LY6. That's the motor out of a current Silverado. 400hp and 400ft/lbs stock. 500-600hp with just a cam. 1000hp+ with a trunk mounted turbocharger. Overall, the car will weigh about as much as a supra. Total assembly cost will be right around $5000 including the cost of the car.....and it could have been done cheaper. I know some people on this board would have a problem with an American car, but this is by far the best way to go faster for cheaper. The only thing Toyota has that would be comparable, that's relatively easy and cost effective, is an early 80's supra or cressida with a 2jzgte. The one's I've wired are extremely fast. 300hp and 2800lbs is not bad. 1/2jzgte's are pretty cheap. Overall, a 20v won't stand up to a modded 4agze, and turboing a 20v is not cheap, but again, if the goal is to build the ultimate drag car, you probably should reconsider using an mr2 in the first place. Last edited by mr220v; 08-05-2009 at 11:24 AM..

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08-03-2009, 08:30 AM	#2 (permalink)
Papo J 6SPD GTE Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 591 Thanks: 2 Thanked 50 Times in 49 Posts iTrader Rating: (0/0% )	GZE hands down, much more usable power than any of the others and much more room to grow out of the box. Ditch the SC, install a small turbo and you can make from about 175 to low 200whp with OEM electronics. BTW, what shop is doing the work for you?

08-03-2009, 09:35 AM	#3 (permalink)
mr220v Beams Owners Group Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 2,529 Thanks: 13 Thanked 176 Times in 147 Posts iTrader Rating: (11/100% )	I don't know about more usable, but more overall power potential for sure.

08-03-2009, 12:43 PM	#4 (permalink)
traintech86 Cage Fighter Join Date: May 2009 Location: Yokosuka, Kanagawa Japan Posts: 1,802 Thanks: 27 Thanked 47 Times in 43 Posts My Google Map iTrader Rating: (3/100% )	a shop called MRD Auto. they seem to know a bit of what they are talking about but i am no expert either. if anyone in here knows anything about them i'd love to hear more. its a lot of money and i wouldn't want to give it to the wrong person. also i kinda like my 2 so i dun want it ruined >>

08-03-2009, 12:46 PM	#5 (permalink)
mr220v Beams Owners Group Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 2,529 Thanks: 13 Thanked 176 Times in 147 Posts iTrader Rating: (11/100% )	You might just ask them which swap they would be most comfortable doing. Nearly any shop should be able to do a usdm GZE swap if they are provided with complete wiring harnesses. The 20v you'll want to qualify with them more.

08-03-2009, 10:02 PM	#6 (permalink)
Papo J 6SPD GTE Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 591 Thanks: 2 Thanked 50 Times in 49 Posts iTrader Rating: (0/0% )	Are you buying the swap and having them install it? I never heard about millennium doing any MK1 MR2 work. If you're buying the swap and just need someone to install it I know of a couple of other places you can call and get estimates also. If you get a GZE set from an MR2 and it comes complete with wiring and electronics you can do the swap in a day.

08-03-2009, 10:58 PM	#7 (permalink)
Jackstand Queen Cage Fighter Join Date: May 2008 Posts: 840 Thanks: 75 Thanked 64 Times in 60 Posts iTrader Rating: (1/100% )	I'd race a BT, or ST for pinks. And make the 20v owner drive the car to my house.

08-04-2009, 09:50 AM	#8 (permalink)
mr220v Beams Owners Group Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 2,529 Thanks: 13 Thanked 176 Times in 147 Posts iTrader Rating: (11/100% )	You know, you left out the various S series motor options. All it takes to beat the best A series motor's stock output is a $500 gen3 3sge. You might not want to deal with the mounting problems, but the more I look at it, the easier it seems to be, and the more I'm considering it for my car. A 2zzge looks promising as well. Pricey though.

08-04-2009, 01:38 PM	#9 (permalink)
traintech86 Cage Fighter Join Date: May 2009 Location: Yokosuka, Kanagawa Japan Posts: 1,802 Thanks: 27 Thanked 47 Times in 43 Posts My Google Map iTrader Rating: (3/100% )	i talked to them about doing a swap before i even bought the car just to get an estimate, i forget for what engine but he def wanted a bit. they sound like a reputable company and seem to know what their talking about. unless anyone posts some bad expiriences i will be hauling my car over there tomarrow. just called the guy and he said he would rather not do it today cause there are crack heads around that like to steal batteries. i was thinkin about that $200 optima i just bought so we're gonna wait till tomarrow haha. as for the 3 series motors, i was looking at the 3sgte and it seemed like a pain in the ass to install. granted they are installing it but i still want a reliable car too and i don't want things to be so complicated that there are problems. this kinda worries me about the a-gze, how reliable is the supercharger on it? my 4a-ge seems rock solid but i dun know about the gze. testomonials? and i am still undecided as to what engine but i am leaning gze.

08-04-2009, 06:05 PM	#10 (permalink)
Papo J 6SPD GTE Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 591 Thanks: 2 Thanked 50 Times in 49 Posts iTrader Rating: (0/0% )	The GZE is as reliable as the AGE if it hasn't been abused. Are you supplying the newer GZE or are they getting it for you? They're not a bad shop from what I've heard but I don't know of any MK1s they've worked on. The swap into your 89 should be plug and play for the most part.

08-04-2009, 07:27 PM	#11 (permalink)
traintech86 Cage Fighter Join Date: May 2009 Location: Yokosuka, Kanagawa Japan Posts: 1,802 Thanks: 27 Thanked 47 Times in 43 Posts My Google Map iTrader Rating: (3/100% )	you're from the VA area? i am not sure who is getting the engine yet. my OD is a bit under 200k and since my engine seems to run fine i want to keep it till 200 and then do the swap. but i want to be prepared for it you know?

08-05-2009, 10:50 AM	#13 (permalink)
Jackstand Queen Cage Fighter Join Date: May 2008 Posts: 840 Thanks: 75 Thanked 64 Times in 60 Posts iTrader Rating: (1/100% )	4agze downers Factory support for the SC itself, and many SC model specific parts has ceased. The 4age will run pretty good, with minor tuning problems, and other small glitches. The 4agze is more intolerant of all sorts of tuning issues. They are more work to keep in tune. This is a tranny issue, but if you have only an SC tranny to work with: there is no rebuilt, or new passenger side axle available. You can only buy a used one, or mail out a worn out one out of state for re-manufacturing. My vote for the 4agze still stands. . . . . BT's and ST's line up, I want to win your car's title in a race.

08-05-2009, 12:00 PM	#15 (permalink)
Jackstand Queen Cage Fighter Join Date: May 2008 Posts: 840 Thanks: 75 Thanked 64 Times in 60 Posts iTrader Rating: (1/100% )	It's ridiculous to think that a heavy (for a 2 seat car), 1.6 liter car can ever compete with a 600 HP muscle type car on the dragstrip. I'd only compete against similarly small engined cars. I like the looks of the early 90's Firebirds. With some suspension mods, and wider tires they handle turns and curves well enough to surprise the heck out this forum's readership. A pair of aftermarket upgrade cams for an MR2, and a stand alone EMS to run the cams could easily cost a couple thousand. A couple of thousand could go so much further on a Firebird. Mr2 upgrades are high priced is all I'm saying. Somebody must have had their "out of the Mr2 box thinking hat on".

08-05-2009, 01:03 PM	#17 (permalink)
DCKilla Cage Fighter Join Date: May 2008 Location: Pearl, MS Posts: 153 Thanks: 1 Thanked 6 Times in 6 Posts iTrader Rating: (0/0% )	I would think that a mk1 BEAMS up against a stock mk2 turbo would be a pretty good drag race. On the track the mk1 BEAMS would out perform that same mk2. I haven't seen it done, but wouldn't be suprised.

08-05-2009, 04:29 PM	#18 (permalink)
mr220v Beams Owners Group Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 2,529 Thanks: 13 Thanked 176 Times in 147 Posts iTrader Rating: (11/100% )	USDM and totally unmodified, I think a beams mk2 probably takes the 3sgte. Less weight and no lag. Same stock hp.

08-08-2009, 05:09 PM	#20 (permalink)
traintech86 Cage Fighter Join Date: May 2009 Location: Yokosuka, Kanagawa Japan Posts: 1,802 Thanks: 27 Thanked 47 Times in 43 Posts My Google Map iTrader Rating: (3/100% )	how much is needed to beams up a mk1?