4AGE: Con rods

[Capt.Evergreen]

Is there a company that make contector rods or even just a good set of gze rods????
Checked HKS, JE, and weisco
Thanks
Capt. EverGreen

[328FTW]

The gze rods are pretty good anyway, they are just not ultra lightweight is all but unless you have a really serious need for ultra lightweight rods you probably don't need them.

What size rods? The gze and 20v have bigger bigends than the early bluetop n/a engines did.

[toyotaspeed90]

Originally Posted by 328FTW

The gze rods are pretty good anyway, they are just not ultra lightweight is all but unless you have a really serious need for ultra lightweight rods you probably don't need them.

What size rods? The gze and 20v have bigger bigends than the early bluetop n/a engines did.

you're actually not completely correct there..... the rod sizes for a 4agze depend on what generation of 4agze you have....

these are all from 16V 4ag's... can you tell which are which?

[328FTW]

Originally Posted by toyotaspeed90

you're actually not completely correct there..... the rod sizes for a 4agze depend on what generation of 4agze you have....

I thought all gze and 20V have the 42mm bigend with the exception of my engine, what generation had 40mm bigends?.

[SteveAW11]

Originally Posted by toyotaspeed90

you're actually not completely correct there..... the rod sizes for a 4agze depend on what generation of 4agze you have....

these are all from 16V 4ag's... can you tell which are which?

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y82...0/DSC_0003.jpg

Left looks to be an 85-86 early 87 rod.
Middle looks like a late 87-89 NA rod
Right looks like a 88-89 GZE Rod or maybe even the AE92 GZE rod.

EDIT: Nope middle is not NA it has Oil squirter cutouts in pistons.
Maybe the middle is the 88-89 GZE
And the right may be the AE92 GZE and smallport rod.

[CpuZapper]

Left is either a GZE or NA from an '87-'90.
Right looks like a smallport GZE.

And the middle could be a late model 16v NA smallport. They did make those with oil squirters, from 1990 on I believe. Though it is either missing a pin retaining clip, or it's one I don't recognize. I rambled, let me try to bring my thoughts together...

IN THE US:
The early 4a (technically up to 87ish, they built some using left over parts) had a 5 rib block, 40mm rod journal, and 18mm pressed in wrist pins. These are most easily identified by their lack of pin retainer clips, and their inability to be separated from the rod without a press. The later model motors - all 16v after as far as I can recall - used a 7 rib block 42mm rod journal, and 20mm floating pins, which require the retainer clips. The oil squirter blocks were available as both the small port NA used in a few cars, and the small port AE101/AE111 SC motors. I've seen factory built motors with 7 rib blocks, and older 40mm/18mm rotating assemblies though. There were also some changes to the oil pump over the years.

I think that's right... it's been way too long since I had to remember all that. Anyways, almost all the rods, the blacktop 20v excluded, are pretty stout. Stock rods hold up rather well, even at high rpm, after a good shotpeening. I've been told, and read, that the stock 4a was tested to 10k rpm continuous, even though they limit at 7.5k.

EDIT:
I left my glasses downstairs, and the pictures aren't that great, so I can't figure out which pistons, if any, have the ceramic coating that would indicate GZE. Also, Carillo used to build all the Group A rods for Toyota, but you'd be hard pressed to find a set, and be prepared to auction off your first born. I've seen the stock GZE MR2 rods handle 350hp on a twin-charged setup. I think you'll be fine. Save the $700 and buy some decent suspension.

[q-authority]

If you absolutely have to have forged rods, then Crower and Pauter make some very good ones for the 4AG(Z)E. There are a few no name brands available as well. As many have said, the stock units will generally work just fine, if they are in decent shape and shot peened etc. However, if you have to save as much weight as possible, then forged might help a bit, but I am not so sure they are hugely lighter. I got some Pauters myself, but they are probably really overkill. I haven't had a chance to pull out the stock ones and compare weights yet, but I hope to within a couple of weeks or so.

[Capt.Evergreen]

So I need either stock( close to zero mile) ze rods or a no name can any one help...

Capt. EverGreen

[te51levin]

Originally Posted by Capt.Evergreen

So I need either stock( close to zero mile) ze rods or a no name...

I don't understand. Rods don't wear over time. Bearings do, but bearings are replaced when you build an engine. Why do you want "zero mile" rods?

If you are choosy enough to look for low mileage rods, why are you also interested in "no name" (i.e. cheap Chinese replica) parts?

[Capt.Evergreen]

Because son,,, I have the shittyest job ever and want to make a reliable motor... I don't know.... I've do serchen forever and I guess I'll just aim for 160 or so horses... 3s would be fun... 4ag is ledgendary I just don't like the b power band to much of the tricky 4a...
Ya... Turbo4a is what I was looken to go for... And reliability... Close to zero miles...
Thanks guys
Capt. EverGreen

[te51levin]

Originally Posted by Capt.Evergreen

Because son,,,

This made me chuckle a little. I'm a grumpy old fart of 35, and I don't know quite what you mean by 'son'. Should I be insulted? Or is that like "my friend" in this case? Either way, I guess I should just move on to the rest of your post...

Originally Posted by Capt.Evergreen

I have the shittyest job ever

OK, so the budget is tight. We've all been there. Hell, I'm still there, and I will be for at least a few more years.

Originally Posted by Capt.Evergreen

and want to make a reliable motor...

Reliable motors aren't generally built of "no name" parts. Brand new or not, cheap is cheap for a reason. Don't spend money on something that serves no purpose and provides no benefit.

Originally Posted by Capt.Evergreen

I don't know.... I've do serchen forever and I guess I'll just aim for 160 or so horses...

That's plenty possible with a prudently built turbo 4AG.

Originally Posted by Capt.Evergreen

3s would be fun...

Yes it would, but on a tight budget, it's not really feasible.

Originally Posted by Capt.Evergreen

4ag is ledgendary I just don't like the b power band to much of the tricky 4a...

I don't know what you mean by "b power band", but 160hp out of an NA 4AG will not have the broad torque curve of a comparably built turbo 4AG.

Originally Posted by Capt.Evergreen

Ya... Turbo4a is what I was looken to go for...

It makes sense *if* you build correctly.

Originally Posted by Capt.Evergreen

And reliability... Close to zero miles...

You're looking at engines that have not been sold in the US since 1991. That's nearly 19 years. "Zero miles" is not realistic, and since connecting rods do not wear out (unless the engine is totally destroyed), you are looking for something that is not necessary, and does not exist anyway. You will be putting new bearings and bolts in the rods, so who cares if the rods have done 20 miles or 200,000? Seriously, the rod itself does not fatigue unless it has seen serious abuse at brutal RPM and/or horsepower levels. Don't waste your time chasing unicorns. Spend that time working, so you can earn more money to put into the things that really do make a difference.


If you are looking to build a mild turbo 4AG on a tight budget, find a good used 4AGZE to build from. It will have stout low-compression pistons and the strongest stock bottom end going, and will hold up to far more than the 160hp figure you are shooting for. Just do yourself a favor and use genuine Toyota parts inside the engine wherever possible. Skimping now and using cheap no-name stuff will come back to haunt you when this thing dumps its guts all over the freeway.

You always hear people say it, and it really is true: There's no such thing as a free lunch!

[toyotaspeed90]

all are 42/20mm rods.... look closely....

left to right:

late bigport 4age
ae101 smallport 4agze
early ae92 smallport n/a

All pulled from my own motors..... all have been verified to be stock.

[Capt.Evergreen]

thanks te51 levin... u told me absolutly nothing.... and are the coolest person every....if thats what ur tryen to hear,, why u copen off a bad aditude were all in love with the same thing.... why are ya pissed off at anyone.... take a toke and relax... I didnt call u an old fart at the nice age of 35... u did,,, figure out ur life then come talk some real talk
Capt. EverGreen
p.s. its not like we live close to each other and could meet and talk ****

[te51levin]

Originally Posted by Capt.Evergreen

thanks te51 levin... u told me absolutly nothing.... and are the coolest person every....if thats what ur tryen to hear,, why u copen off a bad aditude were all in love with the same thing.... why are ya pissed off at anyone.... take a toke and relax... I didnt call u an old fart at the nice age of 35... u did,,, figure out ur life then come talk some real talk
Capt. EverGreen
p.s. its not like we live close to each other and could meet and talk ****

Wow. That was unexpected.

You asked where you could by "zero mile" OEM rods or cheap "no name" aftermarket rods. I explained that you'd never find "low mileage" stock rods, but that it didn't matter, because rods do not wear out, and that generic "no name" eBay parts would be less reliable than any old OEM rod. Those opinions were shared by several others here. Perhaps we didn't tell you what you wanted to hear, but I tried to give you useful information that would help you make good choices and spend your money where it would do the most good. I'm trying to give you information that will help you, not impress you as being "cool."

Along that theme, I am not copping a "bad attitude". You had some very incorrect notions about wear and durability, and/or some unreasonable priorities. I disagree with your logic and I am trying to show you why you shouldn't bother looking for "zero mile" (impossible to find and offer no benefit) or "no name" (cheaply made and likely to fail) rods. My goal is to give you whatever information I have that will help you build a better, more reliable car. I used simple logic to illustrate why I feel your ideas are not valid. If you feel that I am copping a bad attitude simply because I don't agree with your methods, you're missing the point. I am careful not to start internet arguments. If I went around doing that I'd spend half my day on the phone, dealing with people who got their feelings hurt and wanted to tell me what a big doody-head I am because I didn't like their ideas or couldn't read their misspelled, poorly punctuated posts.

I'm not Jesus, but I've been around the block a time or three, and know my way around these cars and these engines. I gave you my best advice based on what I've learned. I answered each of your points, agreeing with the ones that made sense and addressing those that did not. There is no "bad attitude" in that. Your personal attacks at me do not help your build, they do not benefit the community, and they do not change my opinion about connecting rods. Take what you will from the suggestions you've been offered and move forward.

[88*mr2]

Originally Posted by Capt.Evergreen

thanks te51 levin... u told me absolutly nothing.... and are the coolest person every....if thats what ur tryen to hear,, why u copen off a bad aditude were all in love with the same thing.... why are ya pissed off at anyone.... take a toke and relax... I didnt call u an old fart at the nice age of 35... u did,,, figure out ur life then come talk some real talk
Capt. EverGreen
p.s. its not like we live close to each other and could meet and talk ****

he told u alot actually he probly saved u alot because u would have gone and spent 500-800$ on rods u dont really need when all that $ could go someplace useful and mabey give u some hp...new rods wouldnt change the reliability of your motor just the newness of the rods

[lsgheero]

Originally Posted by te51levin

Wow. That was unexpected.

You asked where you could by "zero mile" OEM rods or cheap "no name" aftermarket rods. I explained that you'd never find "low mileage" stock rods, but that it didn't matter, because rods do not wear out, and that generic "no name" eBay parts would be less reliable than any old OEM rod. Those opinions were shared by several others here. Perhaps we didn't tell you what you wanted to hear, but I tried to give you useful information that would help you make good choices and spend your money where it would do the most good. I'm trying to give you information that will help you, not impress you as being "cool."

Along that theme, I am not copping a "bad attitude". You had some very incorrect notions about wear and durability, and/or some unreasonable priorities. I disagree with your logic and I am trying to show you why you shouldn't bother looking for "zero mile" (impossible to find and offer no benefit) or "no name" (cheaply made and likely to fail) rods. My goal is to give you whatever information I have that will help you build a better, more reliable car. I used simple logic to illustrate why I feel your ideas are not valid. If you feel that I am copping a bad attitude simply because I don't agree with your methods, you're missing the point. I am careful not to start internet arguments. If I went around doing that I'd spend half my day on the phone, dealing with people who got their feelings hurt and wanted to tell me what a big doody-head I am because I didn't like their ideas or couldn't read their misspelled, poorly punctuated posts.

I'm not Jesus, but I've been around the block a time or three, and know my way around these cars and these engines. I gave you my best advice based on what I've learned. I answered each of your points, agreeing with the ones that made sense and addressing those that did not. There is no "bad attitude" in that. Your personal attacks at me do not help your build, they do not benefit the community, and they do not change my opinion about connecting rods. Take what you will from the suggestions you've been offered and move forward.

I sir vote you forum role model of the year!

[Allmotor87mr2]

ive got a bunch of good rods are you close to CA?

[David]

This is a really old post. Learn to read guys.

[q-authority]

Originally Posted by David48

This is a really old post. Learn to read guys.

Since when do old posts become insignificant, simply because they are old. If that were the cae, you might as well delete all posts past a certain age, and that I can guarantee you would make just a few people unhappy, as those old posts would have contained a world of useful information.

[David]

You completely missed my point. Allmotor87mr2 was offering a part to someone that's long gone from the forums. You fail at reading comprehension. I'm sorry.