5sfe Forged Pistons

[blumr2]

Just like it sounds. Interested in forged pistons for the 5sfe. Specs etc.

[Weasy2k]

You are interested in it? Or you asking for interest?

Ask and you shall receive

[blumr2]

Both. I have a web site that im using. This is so i can ask some questions and get help filling out the order form

[blumr2]

mrturrari, i pretty much need help filling out the entire form.

[TomsMR2]

.. how about some information on what exactly you're trying to do? you're being extremely vague.

[mrturrari]

Can you list the questions on the form or point us to a link? Also what current mods do you have and what do you plan to do in the future.

[blumr2]

My current mods right now would be just about nothing. I have an HKS cold air intake and thats it. Right now i plan to turbo charge my 5sfe. Im planning to do it with a really low psi so i can use the stock pistons, probably 7 or 8 psi. But eventually when im older and more experienced, and most importantly, have more money, i'd like to turn the boost way up maybe to somewhere around 25 psi, which is why im interested in these custom pistons. Here is the website http://www.atomicspeedware.com/

One of the first things on the form is engine type. Should i put 5sfe, or do they want to know wheter it is turbo charges or naturally aspirated.
Cubic inch displacement- can i say 2.2 or does it have to be exact.
max rpm-6300 right?
Bore size- you were saying 87.25, or 87.5, or even 87.75 to get the cylinder walls cleaned up
stroke- 91mm right?
rod length- ? and steel or aluminum?
rod small end width- ?
Thickness above pin- ?
Compression Height- ?
block height- ?
Compression Ratio- ?
Head gasket thickness- ?
Deck Clearance- ?
Positive or negative volume needed- ?
piston type- dome, flat top, dish, or inverted dome

and thats just the first section . . .

thanks for all the help

[Mach2]

Originally Posted by blumr2

My current mods right now would be just about nothing. I have an HKS cold air intake and thats it. Right now i plan to turbo charge my 5sfe. Im planning to do it with a really low psi so i can use the stock pistons, probably 7 or 8 psi. But eventually when im older and more experienced, and most importantly, have more money, i'd like to turn the boost way up maybe to somewhere around 25 psi, which is why im interested in these custom pistons. Here is the website http://www.atomicspeedware.com/

One of the first things on the form is engine type. Should i put 5sfe, or do they want to know wheter it is turbo charges or naturally aspirated.
Cubic inch displacement- can i say 2.2 or does it have to be exact.
max rpm-6300 right?
Bore size- you were saying 87.25, or 87.5, or even 87.75 to get the cylinder walls cleaned up
stroke- 91mm right?
rod length- ? and steel or aluminum?
rod small end width- ?
Thickness above pin- ?
Compression Height- ?
block height- ?
Compression Ratio- ?
Head gasket thickness- ?
Deck Clearance- ?
Positive or negative volume needed- ?
piston type- dome, flat top, dish, or inverted dome

and thats just the first section . . .

thanks for all the help

Well I have some forged 5sfe pistons if you are interested Pm me if your looking for some..

[mrturrari]

Just something to think about... If your engine is still pretty much stock you may want to hold off on buying the pistons until you have a better idea about how far you want to take this. You see, a lot of the information they need depends on other mods and if you don't know yet what those will be then you could end up with pistons that don't really match what you want to do with your engine. I can see where you are coming from wanting to make the engine stronger and more resistant to detonation however it is not needed to run 6-9psi and when you want to run higher boost you will need many more mods to get there safely. I would at least figure out what other internal engine mods you are going to do before getting the pistons.

If you call Nick at Atomic Speedware he can fill in the answers to many of these questions. You just need to tell him what is unique on your engine and maybe a couple of other details. The form was made for people who build custom race engines and want to be able to specify every little thing so you don't actually need all of them answered.

Should i put 5sfe, or do they want to know wheter it is turbo charges or naturally aspirated. - Just put <year> 5sfe. Nick should have the specs for a stock 5sfe along with other custom ones he has done before.
Cubic inch displacement- can i say 2.2 or does it have to be exact. - He can deduce the actual displacement from your bore and stroke so 2.2 liters is fine.
max rpm-6300 right? - Yes but is this where you are going to keep it?
Bore size- you were saying 87.25, or 87.5, or even 87.75 to get the cylinder walls cleaned up - You will need to take the block to a machine shop to have this measured. They can tell you if it has been bored before and if it needs more to make the cylinders within spec again. They will need to bore it after you get your pistons so they can bore it to the exact specs provided with the pistons.
stroke- 91mm right? - Yes.
rod length- ? and steel or aluminum? - Stock rods are steel and 5.435". That may be off by a couple of thousandths depending on whether yours have been reconditioned or are after market.
rod small end width- ? - I don't know the stock rod width. You should be able to measure this yourself on the stock or forged rods whatever you use. It's simply the width of the rod where the pin meets the piston. If you ever plan to run forged rods you need to account for this. Most are wider and so will not fit if your pistons were made with the stock width in mind. It costs extra to machine them for the extra width.
Thickness above pin- ? - Let Nick figure this out.
Compression Height- ? - Let Nick figure this out too.
block height- ? - Let Nick figure this out too.
Compression Ratio- ? - This is where you are going to have to make a choice. The stock 9.5:1 is a little high if you run a lot of boost with narrow cams and you don't have the ability to tune it really well. 9.0:1 or 8.5:1 are better but you will loose a little off-boost power.
Head gasket thickness- ? - Depends on what head gasket you plan to use. The stock and later 5sfe MLM gaskets are both about 1mm.
Deck Clearance- ? - Usually you will want this to be 0.000" so you get a good quench height.
Positive or negative volume needed- ? - Let Nick figure this out. It will be positive though.
piston type- dome, flat top, dish, or inverted dome - <b>Dish.

Other questions he will ask:

How much boost? - This will determine the ring gap and how much skirt clearance you need. If you say high boost then there will be more clearance and your motor will have more piston slap and blowby at startup.

Valve size and cam lift? - This determines how big the valve recesses are in the pistons.

Combustion chamber volume? - They need this to make the dish the right size for your CR.

[blumr2]

Wow thanks so much for all that help. I am actually planning to do the 25 psi a long while from now. I just wanted to get all the specs now. But i am probably not knowlegdable enought to do something like boosting this engine that high so i would buy these later when i know more. Im taking this turbo project on as a sort of learning experience so that is why i am going to keep it simple and only boost 6-9 psi for now. I should pretty much be a bolt on type thing. Then later i can upgrade the turbo and get all the internals and other stuff. Hey do you think i will be able to put a turbo on this engine without taking the whole engine out of the car?

[mrturrari]

Sounds like a good plan. The turbo goes in just like it does on a 3sgte so there will be no problem there. Make sure you do lots of research, learn how it all works first and know what you are getting yourself into. Just search for 5sfte and start reading.

[blumr2]

Yeah i've been spending a lot of time in forums and online reading as much as i can about as much as i can. I do have some knowledge of engines from my dad and stuff so im thinking it wont be that difficult. The only problem i see me having is getting the thing tuned. I'll probably just have a shop do that though. Am i right in assuming that you have done this to your car? if so im sure i'll be asking you more questions. haha

[blumr2]

P.S. i've always wondered, how do you figure out what a car's red line is? If you make modifications so it can go higher, how do you know what it is?

[mrturrari]

Yes, I have done most of this to my 5sfe... before I did it I wouldn't have had a clue.

A cars red line is determined by the design of the engine and the ECU is programmed to either cut spark or fuel at that point to keep you from going over it. Usually there are good engineering reasons for keep the engine below that rpm. In the 5sfe the main reason is probably the small rod bolts which will start to stretch if you put too much load on them on the intake stroke. Another possible problem is the oil pump because it wasn't made to spin that fast. It's also possible that the valve springs are not strong enough to go much higher then that so you would get valve float. Lastly you have flow reasons like the cam profile that will make it difficult to make power up above there.

So on a 5sfe if you replace the rods with 3sgte rods, the valve springs with 3sgte or 2jzge springs, oil pump with a 98 5sfe pump and then replace the ECU with a stand alone, you should be able to safely go above the stock red line and then you can focus on making power there using a more aggressive cam profile, larger valves, head porting, tuned intake manifold, headers and exhaust.

[blumr2]

How can you figure out how high above the redline you can go?

[1991mark2]

how high you can go on the redline. I think it depend on the cam lift, valve size and valve springs for the most top parts. and crank, connecting rod and piston pin for the bottom. the higher the red line is the faster the stroke are going to be. there is four stroke in one cycle. so think about how fast the pistion going to be moving for a minute.

[wesnemo]

I have heard that 33 grams of reciprocating weight calculates out to about 20 tons of force at 10,000 rpm. I don't know if that is true. haven't done the calculation.

[blumr2]

Thats insane

[Weasy2k]

I have the ability to produce 5s-fe rods...
All development has been done and they can handle 300whp a cyl