Fast idle unexplainable....

dammule · 04-28-2007, 12:01 PM

Yep that's about it.

New timing belt, properly adjusted per specs

All EGR, EGR modulator, vsv's and the bvsv are clean and appear to be functioning properly

Idle speed control valve tests out ok from specs and we tested it open and closed and it's all good. (cleaned it out before reassembly, it was hanging up closed about halfway, but now it shuts all the way.)

Throttle body looked pretty bad, car had 209k now it is clean and new gasket

swapped ECU's and no change...

No vaccuum leaks, we have checked and rechecked and yeah.... did I mention we checked?

cold start round 1700, operating temp it sits at 1250-1300 rpm. I'm not driving it til it's right. Any fresh ideas?

Thanks

Gairloch · 04-28-2007, 05:38 PM

Have you checked to make sure that the butterfly in the throttle body is sealing properly?

TomsMR2 · 04-29-2007, 12:56 AM

is the idle speed screw turned down?

dammule · 04-29-2007, 03:48 AM

The throttle plate? It seals just fine... and the screw has really no effect.
But thanks guys... every bit helps.

Gairloch · 04-29-2007, 04:17 AM

Just so you know, this is a huge issue with the 5sfe and many people have beaten their heads against this particular wall.

One thing I did that helped with mine was to adjust the AC VSV. This is on the trunk firewall close to the throttle body.

Here's a test you can do, if you haven't already, to make sure that your ISCV is working correctly.

1. Pull the intake tube off the throttle body and locate the hole in the floor of it.
2. Start the car and let it get up to temperature.
3. Cover the hole with your finger.

If the butterfly plate is in perfect condition and you have no vacuum leaks the motor should just about stall when you do this. For normal wear it should still drop down a bit.

Mister2.2 · 04-29-2007, 04:32 AM

Fixing my engine grounds helped mine a bit.

TomsMR2 · 04-29-2007, 04:54 AM

the screw should always have an effect.. id look into that first.

dammule · 04-29-2007, 06:08 AM

Butterfly plate has little wear, but has play left to right while it is mounted however, there is less play and seems to seal fairly well. I will check the screw in the morning. Thanks guys... I'm about to take the car to Atlanta Toyota (practically next door to me) Just to be done with it, but they are expensive... I'm just sick of not driving around in my 2.
In 3 weeks i'm driving it to Houston and I want it all functioning properly.
I will post if the screw helps/doesn't help tomorrow.

Thanks again!

Mister2.2 · 04-29-2007, 10:01 AM

I take it you are in Atlanta Georgia? If so Tora Motorsports is near by.

Check here:

http://www.mr2board.com/forums/georg...highlight=tora

Directions: http://toramotorsports.com/

Gairloch · 04-29-2007, 01:20 PM

Location: Duluth

^^

I think he's about as local to Tora as I am.

dammule · 04-29-2007, 04:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gairloch

Just so you know, this is a huge issue with the 5sfe and many people have beaten their heads against this particular wall.

One thing I did that helped with mine was to adjust the AC VSV. This is on the trunk firewall close to the throttle body.

Here's a test you can do, if you haven't already, to make sure that your ISCV is working correctly.

1. Pull the intake tube off the throttle body and locate the hole in the floor of it.
2. Start the car and let it get up to temperature.
3. Cover the hole with your finger.

If the butterfly plate is in perfect condition and you have no vacuum leaks the motor should just about stall when you do this. For normal wear it should still drop down a bit.

When I plug the hole in the bottom of the thottle body, it barely does anything. So you think the butterfly plate might be the issue? Can you purchase a butterfly plate by itself? I know there are screws there so it is removable, but is that something that toyota will try to sell as one big set.
(throttle body)

D

Gairloch · 04-29-2007, 05:28 PM

What you can do if you want to make sure that's the issue is take a small wet rag and shove it in around the edges of the butterfly plate so you've got a good seal. Then redo the ISCV test and see if it moves. If it still doesn't move the issue lies elsewhere. If it does move then you know that you've got your culprit.

One option for resolving this issue is http://www.maxbore.com. I don'w know if replacing the butterfly valve would be enough because the places inside the TB where it should be making contact probably got worn.

Before you go buying parts or getting machine work done there is actually one more thing you could try. Have you tried setting the throttle stop? That's what controls where the butterfly valve actually stops.

TomsMR2 · 04-29-2007, 09:13 PM

^ good call. all my mr2s have had throttle stop issues when i got them! adjusting it does a lot for idle quality and other things.

dammule · 04-30-2007, 06:19 AM

yeah sorry the throttle stop doesn't do it... i'm more for the butterfly plate. Did you know autozone sells a butterfly plate kit? I just found it on there site. Just so everyone else knows. 3 days special order. I'm going to test the wet rag and then update you all. I love the maxbore idea too.
So many options....

dammule · 05-03-2007, 03:17 PM

It was the left side of the butterfly plate guys... Apparently 209k miles and dirt and usage has not been friendly to my throttle body, I suggest everyone who buys a used 2 clean theirs and inspect soon after they get it. Mine has only gotten worse since I've owned it. I have sent my throttle body to MAXBORE.com after reading reviews and emailing Jorge Pugliese there about my problems. He is very helpful and full of info. Hell man, 140, for a rebuilt and better than new T/B is a great deal!!!

Thanks all for the help. I was losing my mind.
Dammule

Gairloch · 05-03-2007, 04:08 PM

Was your butterfly valve damaged? Any chance you've got pictures of it so others know what to look for?

Good to hear that maxbore has been good to work with so far. Let us know how it comes out!

CyFi · 05-03-2007, 08:40 PM

Mine has problems also, i cant find it in me to go spend 140 just to get it fixed, i cant adjust the stopper right, its either letting in too much air or its closing too much making the plate jam against the walls of the TB in the high spots, this makes the gas pedal stick closed a lot and seriously pisses me off, not to mention it probably is wearing things out good.

CyFi · 05-03-2007, 08:43 PM

also what is this thing on autozone you talk of.

04-28-2007, 12:01 PM	#1 (permalink)
dammule pool junkie Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Duluth Posts: 45 Thanks: 3 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts My Google Map iTrader Rating: (0/0% )	Fast idle unexplainable.... Yep that's about it. New timing belt, properly adjusted per specs All EGR, EGR modulator, vsv's and the bvsv are clean and appear to be functioning properly Idle speed control valve tests out ok from specs and we tested it open and closed and it's all good. (cleaned it out before reassembly, it was hanging up closed about halfway, but now it shuts all the way.) Throttle body looked pretty bad, car had 209k now it is clean and new gasket swapped ECU's and no change... No vaccuum leaks, we have checked and rechecked and yeah.... did I mention we checked? cold start round 1700, operating temp it sits at 1250-1300 rpm. I'm not driving it til it's right. Any fresh ideas? Thanks

04-28-2007, 05:38 PM	#2 (permalink)
Gairloch Dreaming of apexes Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Minneapolis, MN Posts: 4,472 Thanks: 115 Thanked 223 Times in 196 Posts My Google Map iTrader Rating: (7/100% )	Have you checked to make sure that the butterfly in the throttle body is sealing properly? __________________ "Inside the car, the world beyond the driver's immediate horizon ceases to exist. Alone with the solitude of his desire, survival sense numbed by the speed, he's outrun the mediocrity of the outside world, slipped the shackles it tries to clamp on us all. He is running free, chased only by a fear of failure, for failure is to risk ejection into the real world." ~Mark Hughes

04-29-2007, 04:17 AM	#5 (permalink)
Gairloch Dreaming of apexes Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Minneapolis, MN Posts: 4,472 Thanks: 115 Thanked 223 Times in 196 Posts My Google Map iTrader Rating: (7/100% )	Just so you know, this is a huge issue with the 5sfe and many people have beaten their heads against this particular wall. One thing I did that helped with mine was to adjust the AC VSV. This is on the trunk firewall close to the throttle body. Here's a test you can do, if you haven't already, to make sure that your ISCV is working correctly. 1. Pull the intake tube off the throttle body and locate the hole in the floor of it. 2. Start the car and let it get up to temperature. 3. Cover the hole with your finger. If the butterfly plate is in perfect condition and you have no vacuum leaks the motor should just about stall when you do this. For normal wear it should still drop down a bit. Last edited by Gairloch; 04-29-2007 at 04:42 AM.

04-29-2007, 04:32 AM	#6 (permalink)
Mister2.2 Cheese it! Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 6,220 Thanks: 106 Thanked 107 Times in 92 Posts Blog Entries: 1 My Google Map iTrader Rating: (3/100% )	Fixing my engine grounds helped mine a bit. __________________ --Josh MR2Trader.com Free Accounts to Buy and Sell your MR2 Parts! Deal of the Week: MR2Only Magazine, Get it NOW! Click Here. Ask me about Web Hosting Solutions, starting at $5.95 a month. 'I am at two with nature.' 'Students achieving Oneness will move on to Twoness.'

04-29-2007, 06:08 AM	#8 (permalink)
dammule pool junkie Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Duluth Posts: 45 Thanks: 3 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts My Google Map iTrader Rating: (0/0% )	unexplainable fast idle Butterfly plate has little wear, but has play left to right while it is mounted however, there is less play and seems to seal fairly well. I will check the screw in the morning. Thanks guys... I'm about to take the car to Atlanta Toyota (practically next door to me) Just to be done with it, but they are expensive... I'm just sick of not driving around in my 2. In 3 weeks i'm driving it to Houston and I want it all functioning properly. I will post if the screw helps/doesn't help tomorrow. Thanks again!

04-29-2007, 12:56 AM	#3 (permalink)
TomsMR2 Formerly Tom Brokaw Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Bay Area Posts: 2,138 Thanks: 8 Thanked 165 Times in 138 Posts Blog Entries: 1 iTrader Rating: (0/0% )	is the idle speed screw turned down?

04-29-2007, 03:48 AM	#4 (permalink)
dammule pool junkie Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Duluth Posts: 45 Thanks: 3 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts My Google Map iTrader Rating: (0/0% )	The throttle plate? It seals just fine... and the screw has really no effect. But thanks guys... every bit helps.

04-29-2007, 04:54 AM	#7 (permalink)
TomsMR2 Formerly Tom Brokaw Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Bay Area Posts: 2,138 Thanks: 8 Thanked 165 Times in 138 Posts Blog Entries: 1 iTrader Rating: (0/0% )	the screw should always have an effect.. id look into that first.

04-29-2007, 10:01 AM	#9 (permalink)
Mister2.2 Cheese it! Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 6,220 Thanks: 106 Thanked 107 Times in 92 Posts Blog Entries: 1 My Google Map iTrader Rating: (3/100% )	I take it you are in Atlanta Georgia? If so Tora Motorsports is near by. Check here: http://www.mr2board.com/forums/georg...highlight=tora Directions: http://toramotorsports.com/

04-29-2007, 01:20 PM	#10 (permalink)
Gairloch Dreaming of apexes Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Minneapolis, MN Posts: 4,472 Thanks: 115 Thanked 223 Times in 196 Posts My Google Map iTrader Rating: (7/100% )	Location: Duluth ^^ I think he's about as local to Tora as I am.

04-29-2007, 05:28 PM	#12 (permalink)
Gairloch Dreaming of apexes Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Minneapolis, MN Posts: 4,472 Thanks: 115 Thanked 223 Times in 196 Posts My Google Map iTrader Rating: (7/100% )	What you can do if you want to make sure that's the issue is take a small wet rag and shove it in around the edges of the butterfly plate so you've got a good seal. Then redo the ISCV test and see if it moves. If it still doesn't move the issue lies elsewhere. If it does move then you know that you've got your culprit. One option for resolving this issue is http://www.maxbore.com. I don'w know if replacing the butterfly valve would be enough because the places inside the TB where it should be making contact probably got worn. Before you go buying parts or getting machine work done there is actually one more thing you could try. Have you tried setting the throttle stop? That's what controls where the butterfly valve actually stops.

04-29-2007, 09:13 PM	#13 (permalink)
TomsMR2 Formerly Tom Brokaw Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Bay Area Posts: 2,138 Thanks: 8 Thanked 165 Times in 138 Posts Blog Entries: 1 iTrader Rating: (0/0% )	^ good call. all my mr2s have had throttle stop issues when i got them! adjusting it does a lot for idle quality and other things.

04-30-2007, 06:19 AM	#14 (permalink)
dammule pool junkie Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Duluth Posts: 45 Thanks: 3 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts My Google Map iTrader Rating: (0/0% )	yeah sorry the throttle stop doesn't do it... i'm more for the butterfly plate. Did you know autozone sells a butterfly plate kit? I just found it on there site. Just so everyone else knows. 3 days special order. I'm going to test the wet rag and then update you all. I love the maxbore idea too. So many options....

05-03-2007, 03:17 PM	#15 (permalink)
dammule pool junkie Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Duluth Posts: 45 Thanks: 3 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts My Google Map iTrader Rating: (0/0% )	It was the left side of the butterfly plate guys... Apparently 209k miles and dirt and usage has not been friendly to my throttle body, I suggest everyone who buys a used 2 clean theirs and inspect soon after they get it. Mine has only gotten worse since I've owned it. I have sent my throttle body to MAXBORE.com after reading reviews and emailing Jorge Pugliese there about my problems. He is very helpful and full of info. Hell man, 140, for a rebuilt and better than new T/B is a great deal!!! Thanks all for the help. I was losing my mind. Dammule

05-03-2007, 04:08 PM	#16 (permalink)
Gairloch Dreaming of apexes Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Minneapolis, MN Posts: 4,472 Thanks: 115 Thanked 223 Times in 196 Posts My Google Map iTrader Rating: (7/100% )	Was your butterfly valve damaged? Any chance you've got pictures of it so others know what to look for? Good to hear that maxbore has been good to work with so far. Let us know how it comes out!

05-03-2007, 08:40 PM	#17 (permalink)
CyFi ShamWOW! Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 1,390 Thanks: 12 Thanked 38 Times in 35 Posts iTrader Rating: (10/100% )	Mine has problems also, i cant find it in me to go spend 140 just to get it fixed, i cant adjust the stopper right, its either letting in too much air or its closing too much making the plate jam against the walls of the TB in the high spots, this makes the gas pedal stick closed a lot and seriously pisses me off, not to mention it probably is wearing things out good.

05-03-2007, 08:43 PM	#18 (permalink)
CyFi ShamWOW! Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 1,390 Thanks: 12 Thanked 38 Times in 35 Posts iTrader Rating: (10/100% )	also what is this thing on autozone you talk of.