G-Tech RR - Dragon vs The Black Knight

mrturrari · 09-29-2009, 12:30 AM

Hey guys, tonight I finally decided to advance my timing on the Dragon and see what it would do. Since I am running NA at 9:1 CR and have the knock system I was not too worried about detonation but I still kept my ear open. I ended up just advancing it across the board by 5 degrees and let the knock system fine tune it. The difference was imediately noticable. Just for comparison I took some runs in my black 92 stock NA MR2 (The Black Knight) and adjusted the weight to try to account for my altitude here at 4300ft. When I hit about 110rwhp and 140rwtq I called it good and did both cars. The teal car (Dragon) is actually about 50 pounds heavier because of the power options, larger wheels, brakes and stereo system.

Please take these results with a grain of salt because a G-Tech doesn't account for altitude, gearing or wind resistance. My top end would actually appear stronger on a dyno with both cars because there is no increasing wind resistance on a dyno. Still it gives you a good idea of the torque curves and how much more power my built 5sfe has over stock. Except for the base run from a couple of weeks ago these were all done within about an hour of each other on the same stretch of road.

Black - The Black Knight base run tonight (Completely stock 5sfe in a no options hard top MR2)
Blue - Dragon base run I did earlier this month
Green - Dragon base run tonight before adjusting timing
Red - Dragon run tonight after advancing timing 5 degrees

Just thought I would share.

Redstar · 09-30-2009, 10:32 AM

I always like seeing real data!

One question, though. Vehicle weight is 5200lbs. I'm doubting that's an error, are you doing that to account for the other variables you mentioned like altitude? If so, how did you come up with 5200lbs?

Thanks for sharing!

mrturrari · 09-30-2009, 12:23 PM

Basically I just did a few runs in the black car with different weights until it showed about 110rwhp. The compensation is actually for both altitude and gearing to try to get some torque curves that would be comparable to each other and close to what would be seen on a dyno. It's not exactly an accurate way to do it but I was looking for a ballpark comparison. Looking at it now though I realize that the GTech is reading a little low in RPMs for the black car. That would make the HP numbers a bit high for both cars. I'm guessing my built 5sfe is right around 150rwhp after the timing change.

These curves did allow me to figure out my shift points though for best straight line acceleration. By my math I should be shifting at 7300 from 1st to 2nd, 7100 from 2nd to 3rd and 6800 from 3rd to 4th.

mrturrari · 10-04-2009, 03:12 AM

New video of what it looks like from my point of view:

YouTube - NA Mr2 5sfe (The Dragon) - various...

mrturrari · 10-10-2009, 11:59 PM

I went out a G-Teched both cars again tonight (yes I know I am obsessed) this time in 1st gear because there is less wind resistance to skew the numbers between torque and HP. This time I got the black car reading the RPM correctly too.

Blue - Stock NA MR2s make about 130rwtq so I adjusted weight until it was close
Green - Stock NA MR2s make about 110rwhp so I adjusted weight until it was close
Black - Built NA using the same weight as the black car when it made 130rwtq
Red - Built NA using the same weight as the black car when it made 110rwhp

Understand these numbers will be a little low because the built car weighs 50-100 pounds more then the stock one and has 18" wheels and tires that are about 1" taller. The torque will read a little low because of the change in gearing this causes as well as the increased weight. Not as good as a real dyno but I am convinced I have passed 150rwhp lol.

09-29-2009, 12:30 AM	#1 (permalink)
mrturrari I <3 my 5sfe Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Salt Lake City, Utah Posts: 655 Thanks: 2 Thanked 170 Times in 113 Posts iTrader Rating: (0/0% )	G-Tech RR - Dragon vs The Black Knight Hey guys, tonight I finally decided to advance my timing on the Dragon and see what it would do. Since I am running NA at 9:1 CR and have the knock system I was not too worried about detonation but I still kept my ear open. I ended up just advancing it across the board by 5 degrees and let the knock system fine tune it. The difference was imediately noticable. Just for comparison I took some runs in my black 92 stock NA MR2 (The Black Knight) and adjusted the weight to try to account for my altitude here at 4300ft. When I hit about 110rwhp and 140rwtq I called it good and did both cars. The teal car (Dragon) is actually about 50 pounds heavier because of the power options, larger wheels, brakes and stereo system. Please take these results with a grain of salt because a G-Tech doesn't account for altitude, gearing or wind resistance. My top end would actually appear stronger on a dyno with both cars because there is no increasing wind resistance on a dyno. Still it gives you a good idea of the torque curves and how much more power my built 5sfe has over stock. Except for the base run from a couple of weeks ago these were all done within about an hour of each other on the same stretch of road. Black - The Black Knight base run tonight (Completely stock 5sfe in a no options hard top MR2) Blue - Dragon base run I did earlier this month Green - Dragon base run tonight before adjusting timing Red - Dragon run tonight after advancing timing 5 degrees Just thought I would share.

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09-30-2009, 10:32 AM	#2 (permalink)
Redstar My other cars are jealous Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Bellingham, WA Posts: 439 Thanks: 21 Thanked 40 Times in 29 Posts iTrader Rating: (12/100% )	I always like seeing real data! One question, though. Vehicle weight is 5200lbs. I'm doubting that's an error, are you doing that to account for the other variables you mentioned like altitude? If so, how did you come up with 5200lbs? Thanks for sharing!

09-30-2009, 12:23 PM	#3 (permalink)
mrturrari I <3 my 5sfe Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Salt Lake City, Utah Posts: 655 Thanks: 2 Thanked 170 Times in 113 Posts iTrader Rating: (0/0% )	Basically I just did a few runs in the black car with different weights until it showed about 110rwhp. The compensation is actually for both altitude and gearing to try to get some torque curves that would be comparable to each other and close to what would be seen on a dyno. It's not exactly an accurate way to do it but I was looking for a ballpark comparison. Looking at it now though I realize that the GTech is reading a little low in RPMs for the black car. That would make the HP numbers a bit high for both cars. I'm guessing my built 5sfe is right around 150rwhp after the timing change. These curves did allow me to figure out my shift points though for best straight line acceleration. By my math I should be shifting at 7300 from 1st to 2nd, 7100 from 2nd to 3rd and 6800 from 3rd to 4th.

10-10-2009, 11:59 PM	#5 (permalink)
mrturrari I <3 my 5sfe Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Salt Lake City, Utah Posts: 655 Thanks: 2 Thanked 170 Times in 113 Posts iTrader Rating: (0/0% )	I went out a G-Teched both cars again tonight (yes I know I am obsessed) this time in 1st gear because there is less wind resistance to skew the numbers between torque and HP. This time I got the black car reading the RPM correctly too. Blue - Stock NA MR2s make about 130rwtq so I adjusted weight until it was close Green - Stock NA MR2s make about 110rwhp so I adjusted weight until it was close Black - Built NA using the same weight as the black car when it made 130rwtq Red - Built NA using the same weight as the black car when it made 110rwhp Understand these numbers will be a little low because the built car weighs 50-100 pounds more then the stock one and has 18" wheels and tires that are about 1" taller. The torque will read a little low because of the change in gearing this causes as well as the increased weight. Not as good as a real dyno but I am convinced I have passed 150rwhp lol.