S2S Tuning Cam Development...5s-fe..Discuss!

[Weasy2k]

Well its time to start talking to the people who mean the most....YOU....5s owners...about what they want out of their motor.

I know cams would be a nice little add on to the engine to give a bit more omph in the engine.

What are you guys looking for?





Once again the fall off on the engine is large. I am estimating a 10-20whp gain in PEAK power with a fuller powerband all together.

I plan to make N/A cams, Turbo cams and a s/c cams...for uhh...something

Please feel free to talk about this and send me links of other company's that already make cams as i would love to research more.

Thanks guys!

[CyFi]

oops, stolen pic, cant say where i got it, the blue is 5sfe

[TomsMR2]

if they're more than 300 you'd have a really really hard time convincing me not to buy paeco/ted cams instead.. also considering that paeco/ted will grind out the duration and lift according to what you ask for, its not too bad of a deal.

it would be great if you offered up something, but in all fairness it has to be competitive.

[Mister2.2]

Yeah but Tom have you ever got ahold of Ted? From what I know nobody has been able to get regrinds from him.

[Weasy2k]

also who said i wont have the grind you want? I can do anything almost

I also average 120-150 per cam...so its nto to bad for a regrind

[TomsMR2]

if you can do 120-150 per cam, i will send cams to you

[TomsMR2]

Originally Posted by Mister2.2

Yeah but Tom have you ever got ahold of Ted? From what I know nobody has been able to get regrinds from him.

i dont think any 5sfe guys have really tried.. the mk1 guys dont seem to have any problems getting ted products.

from the first post it seemed like you were gonna be offering a cam, not a service for cams.. i know alot of us would be very interested in custom ground cams! keep us updated, please.

[TomsMR2]

another thing.. heres a big problem..

reshimming 93+ heads. you should offer a solution for 93+ for shims.. even a mild grind would require quite a fat puck, probably in a size that doesnt actually exist.

the 91 guys can use 93 cams ground fit damn near perfectly, and just toss some shims around to fit.. but for 93+ its a real problem, and webcam rewelds are realistically the only option.

[PHOENIX]

Originally Posted by Weasy2k

also who said i wont have the grind you want? I can do anything almost

*cough* 99 beams VVT-I Cams *cough*

[Weasy2k]

Originally Posted by TomsMR2

another thing.. heres a big problem..

reshimming 93+ heads. you should offer a solution for 93+ for shims.. even a mild grind would require quite a fat puck, probably in a size that doesnt actually exist.

the 91 guys can use 93 cams ground fit damn near perfectly, and just toss some shims around to fit.. but for 93+ its a real problem, and webcam rewelds are realistically the only option.

In development my friend

Plus my cams come with a spacer which adds up to 30 thou of room.

Just enough for 272 deg cams

I need to get some lifters of the 91 and 93 5s's as well as the valve springs for them.

I have TONS of projects on the go. So much fun developing stuff.

[Weasy2k]

Originally Posted by PHOENIX

*cough* 99 beams VVT-I Cams *cough*

yep...im going to have a talk with the grinder and we can see what needs to be done...and if he can do it...

hes busy right now with a group buy of 120...thats right one hundred and twenty DIESEL cams from the 7.1L TD...so awesome!

He is goign to teach me the basics when hes less busy...will be nice to learn

[PHOENIX]

no problem, i dont even have the engine on the stand yet, its sitting on a couple of tires till i get a few guys together to lift it up (hopefully this weekend) then i will start tearing it apart.

It will probably be a month before i decide what to do with the cams, and the engine for that fact, not sure which way im going with it.

i can find out though what the TRD durations are though so you guys can just copy them (if possible), or whichever one i pick.

[Weasy2k]

yea get me all the specs...ill see what i then can do

[erioshi]

Honestly, how hard would adding shimless buckets be to your cam options? The shim & puck process is something that's slow and time consuming and ditracts from the idea of swaping cams in Toyota engines. Not to mention it seems very akward in a modern engine - even my '64 Triump Spitfire had adjustable rockers.

For 5sfe cams, I would definitely recommend extending the power band upward, even at the expense of some low end torque. The N/A MKII falls dead at about 5,000 rpms - with some tweaks and exhaust work it makes it to about 5,300. The car really needs to pull all the way to 6,000 (or at least 5,800) - it would really change how the car feels at speed.

Peaking the car's HP near redline would also make the car much easier for most people to drive fast - no more worrying about unnaturally low shift points to get maximum acceleration. I think that change alone would make the car easier to drive for most people who AutoX, Road Course or Drag.

(and PM or call me about some 1mz-fe cams, lol)

[TomsMR2]

you can get the motor to pull to damn near 6K while actually increasing low end torque with a cam.. the stock cams are just terrible.. an upgrade just brings it to an efficient level, not even beginning to compromise.

[mrturrari]

I would love to see some more options for 5sfe cams but I agree with Tom that grind options are going to be limited for 93+ cams. Hard welding may be the only way you will get an aggresive set because of the shim issues. The other problem is that if you go too aggresive you will outrun the stock fuel system. I believe that is why Webcams only offers their 101 grind at 250 degrees duration and also recommends fuel managment with them. If you put 264 or bigger cams on a I/H/E 5sfe you should be able to hit more then 150rwhp and the injectors probably won't flow enough fuel for that.

[Weasy2k]

Erioshi,
You pritty much got my goals explained right there. That is something i have understood by reading the dyno plots of some of these engines. It will make the car just that much enjoyable. My dads 4runner 3.0L 3vz-e was a POS to drive anywhere, now it actually moves a bit more and on teh highway it has the balls to pass. I am going to be buying some lifter & spring combos for the 93+ and the pre 93 to see the size difference. The reason why i cant get shimless buckets is because with regrinds you already get less of a option for shim sizes. If you go with a mild grind then yea its easy. I prefer shimming to shimless buckets for basic stuff just becuase its a lot easier to adjust.

TomsMr2,
I agree with this too, a basic mild cam would be perfect for everyday use.

Mrturrari,
I have other tricks up my sleeve for these engines, and once i get some research done on the lifter/shim/spring combo ill be able to provide better products to complement the cams, much like i am doing for the 5vz series.

Thanks for the injector info becuase that is something I didnt look into yet. I plan to buy a pos beater and play around with it here in the shop build the engine up a bit and do many different tests. This will all happen if i can get that dyno im after.

[erioshi]

This may be kind of backwards compared to how most people approach NA builds, but has anyone looked into the gains possibile with just engine management (a piggy-back for example)? On some cars just EM changes can really open up even a stock vehicle.

Anyway - I can't wait to get to the point where I can mess with the cam timing a bit - if nothing else I should be able to move the power band up using that.

[TomsMR2]

an ems really smooths out the power, and theres a definite gain to be had.. but the head is just not going to suck in the air you need with those mosquito bite cams. considering that the options for cams is becoming affordable, at least the intake cam should be changed to really get the most out of an ems.

[Weasy2k]

I hav put piggybacks on N/A vehicles before and managed as mentioned a smoother power band with an increase of 10-20whp depending on the vehicle.

You will not really be able ot adjust hte cam timing unless you manage to make an adjustable mesh gear that moves the 2nd cam.