Stand Alone = 1st mod?

Mr. Baskerville · 04-06-2008, 07:00 AM

What do you guys think about using a tunable ems (fully programmable) and any accompanying sensors along with dyno tune as a first mod for a 91 Turbo?

I plan on doing some other things with the motor and upgrading the turbo after the fact, but i wondered if the factory setup with a few bolt ons would be able to support more power with better engine management. Also, i'm assuming that i could have a secondary map designed around fuel economy by sacrificing a few ponies?

Ben · 04-06-2008, 01:32 PM

You would be better off with the bolt ons then the stand alone. The stock computer is pretty adaptable. Have you read the power primer?

mr2ya · 04-06-2008, 01:55 PM

i agree
but up to 50hp has been found just by tuning.
thats alot of money to spend on something at first.
your engine, trans and other is going to need attention sooner than you think,
trust me

shimric · 04-06-2008, 08:08 PM

Bolts-ons as a first mod would be a better choice. Intake, Exhaust, Bigger turbo, fuel rail, injectors. Then you'd be wanting Stand alone.

Mr. Baskerville · 04-06-2008, 10:23 PM

i have glanced over the power primer, but i sort of wanted to take it in a few big, well planned steps. the power primer seemed to cater toward replacing a few little things at a time. my plan was to rebuild the motor to flow air a little better and build up the bottom end to be a little more durable whilst replacing every gasket and seal. then the motor would be better prepared to handle the 300-400 whp i want to get reliably (with the u/g turbo of course). while the motor was out, i planned on either adding an lsd to the tranny i have now or replacing with a 93+.

after that i would select a upgraded turbo and its accessories to go on the motor.

i suppose i could wait for the ems until i'm actually building the motor, but i wondered if i would see any significant gains in engine performance by simply retuning it.

seems like the general consensus so far is that i wouldn't.

mr2ya · 04-07-2008, 12:53 AM

20-50hp on stock engine

RickyB · 04-08-2008, 08:04 PM

There is absolutely nothing wrong with starting with a good plug and play EMS as your first modification. It is the one component that you know will not need to be re-upgraded later on as your power goals change. Add a good tuner to the mix, and you can count on always getting the most safe power out of your setup at each of your upgrade stages.

PearlJammzz · 04-09-2008, 04:06 PM

If the power goals you are going for will require an EMS, sure. If all you ever wanna hit is 250rwhp, not worth it. If you wanna start w/ a solid EMS now that can grow with you as you mod and are, in the end, going for good power (300+) then for sure might as well get the EMS.

You can def get more power for cheaper on a stock motor, but it'll allow your future mods to give a little more power as you get them vs being on stock ECU.

04-06-2008, 07:00 AM	#1 (permalink)
Mr. Baskerville Alexander Supertramp Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Atlanta, GA Posts: 32 Thanks: 7 Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts iTrader Rating: (0/0% )	Stand Alone = 1st mod? What do you guys think about using a tunable ems (fully programmable) and any accompanying sensors along with dyno tune as a first mod for a 91 Turbo? I plan on doing some other things with the motor and upgrading the turbo after the fact, but i wondered if the factory setup with a few bolt ons would be able to support more power with better engine management. Also, i'm assuming that i could have a secondary map designed around fuel economy by sacrificing a few ponies?

04-06-2008, 01:55 PM	#3 (permalink)
mr2ya Banned Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: memphis TN. Posts: 261 Thanks: 1 Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts iTrader Rating: (0/0% )	i agree but up to 50hp has been found just by tuning. thats alot of money to spend on something at first. your engine, trans and other is going to need attention sooner than you think, trust me Last edited by mr2ya; 04-06-2008 at 02:52 PM.

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04-06-2008, 01:32 PM	#2 (permalink)
Ben Same In The End Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Oceanside, CA / Reno, NV Posts: 3,927 Thanks: 18 Thanked 276 Times in 258 Posts My Google Map iTrader Rating: (11/100% )	You would be better off with the bolt ons then the stand alone. The stock computer is pretty adaptable. Have you read the power primer?

04-06-2008, 08:08 PM	#4 (permalink)
shimric Führer of OT!!! Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: South Carolina Posts: 1,394 Thanks: 40 Thanked 45 Times in 38 Posts Blog Entries: 1 iTrader Rating: (0/0% )	Bolts-ons as a first mod would be a better choice. Intake, Exhaust, Bigger turbo, fuel rail, injectors. Then you'd be wanting Stand alone.

04-06-2008, 10:23 PM	#5 (permalink)
Mr. Baskerville Alexander Supertramp Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Atlanta, GA Posts: 32 Thanks: 7 Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts iTrader Rating: (0/0% )	i have glanced over the power primer, but i sort of wanted to take it in a few big, well planned steps. the power primer seemed to cater toward replacing a few little things at a time. my plan was to rebuild the motor to flow air a little better and build up the bottom end to be a little more durable whilst replacing every gasket and seal. then the motor would be better prepared to handle the 300-400 whp i want to get reliably (with the u/g turbo of course). while the motor was out, i planned on either adding an lsd to the tranny i have now or replacing with a 93+. after that i would select a upgraded turbo and its accessories to go on the motor. i suppose i could wait for the ems until i'm actually building the motor, but i wondered if i would see any significant gains in engine performance by simply retuning it. seems like the general consensus so far is that i wouldn't.

04-07-2008, 12:53 AM	#6 (permalink)
mr2ya Banned Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: memphis TN. Posts: 261 Thanks: 1 Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts iTrader Rating: (0/0% )	20-50hp on stock engine

04-08-2008, 08:04 PM	#7 (permalink)
RickyB Automotive Cartographer Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: California Posts: 221 Thanks: 0 Thanked 114 Times in 33 Posts iTrader Rating: (0/0% )	There is absolutely nothing wrong with starting with a good plug and play EMS as your first modification. It is the one component that you know will not need to be re-upgraded later on as your power goals change. Add a good tuner to the mix, and you can count on always getting the most safe power out of your setup at each of your upgrade stages.

04-09-2008, 04:06 PM	#8 (permalink)
PearlJammzz Cage Fighter Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 2,140 Thanks: 9 Thanked 70 Times in 66 Posts My Google Map iTrader Rating: (7/100% )	If the power goals you are going for will require an EMS, sure. If all you ever wanna hit is 250rwhp, not worth it. If you wanna start w/ a solid EMS now that can grow with you as you mod and are, in the end, going for good power (300+) then for sure might as well get the EMS. You can def get more power for cheaper on a stock motor, but it'll allow your future mods to give a little more power as you get them vs being on stock ECU.