Opinions on the "Mega-Squirt" EMS? : Ongoing MegaSquirt Discussion

Mekkahfire · 07-01-2006, 02:01 AM

Ive been reading a lot on this "mega squirt" EMS which only runs 200-300 dollars. Its all open source programming written in C++, so its completely modifyable, you assemble it all yourself (soddering resistors, etc), and you make your own wiring harness.

I met a guy tonight at a local car meet who has this on his 2.0L dodge neon. Hes running a F350 Turbo deisel tubo on his neon and using the mega squirt squeezed 315 horsepower at the wheels at 13psi. And from what i saw, its very responsive to the laptop hes got it connected to.

Tuners: any oppinions on it??????

Raptor13x · 07-01-2006, 12:08 PM

I actually have one, but I've never ended up using it. (yet) The MS is definately an excellent EMS for the money, but it doesn't have a lot of the features and support that the more expensive systems have. You can download the tuning program for free and play around with it if you want. There's also some forums devoted to it.

Mekkahfire · 07-01-2006, 02:08 PM

Heres some more info on it that i researched..

The MegaSquirt 2 Standalone EMS is the latest product from Bowling and Grippo. Truly the dream ECU computer for the DIYer. This latest rendition can control fuel, ignition, stepper motor IAC, and more for your turbo, supercharged, or naturally aspirated engine. More information about MegaSquirt-II can be found at http://www.megasquirt.info/ms2.

MegaSquirt II includes all of the features and benefits of the original...
Onboard MAP sensor for NA or boosted engines up to 21psi!
Speed density or Alpha-N.
Use any injector - High or Low impedance.
Compatible with output from narrowband and wideband O2 sensors.
Log data on your laptop for later analysis.
Tuning software is free for download and regularly updated with new features.
Open Source design - all code and hardware information is available online.
Includes proper female DB37 connector and shell for your wiring harness.

Additional Features new to the MegaSquirt-II
24 MHz HCS12 processor,
Fuel control to 1 µsec (100 times more resolution than MegaSquirt-I),
Ignition control (full spark timing advance control, dwell control, etc) for one coil/distributor (7 pin HEI for example) and Ford's EDIS systems,
On-board stepper motor driver for IAC stepper control (this requires a few jumpers to be added on the MegaSquirt PCB to connect the socket jumpers to the DB37 connector),
Ford PWM idle valve support,
Built-in rev limiter, either 'fuel cut' or 'spark retard',
All tables are now 12×12 in size,
WBO2 AFR target table (in AFR units),
Independent dual-tables for VE and AFR target,
EGO feedback in wide-band mode is proportional to the difference between the measured AFR and the target AFR, the bigger the difference, the bigger the feedback step,
Spark advance table can have different rpm and kpa bins than VE and AFR tables,
115,200 baud serial interface with MegaTune2.25+,
CANbus networking
Barometric correction amount and direction configurable in software, and provisions for:
barometric correction based on initial MAP reading,
independent 2nd barometric MAP sensor for continuous real-time baro correction, or
no baro correction.
TPS values for open loop and flood clear mode are user configurable,
MAP based open loop can be set as well as TPS,
Both TPS and MAP based accel enrichment is built into the code, you can configure the ratio of each,
Blended Alpha-N and speed density is an option,
2 spare I/O lines for custom controls. (This is in addition to 4 lines for Idle stepper control if you don't need this, or the Fast idle solenoid then becomes a spare if you do use a stepper motor.)

DIYAutoTune Kits and Completed Units also Feature:
Extruded Aluminum case with CNC machined flanged ends for easy mounting and a perfect fit!
The crystal and all nuts are glued in place to reduce sensitivity to vibrations. (Completed units)

Open Source means Endless Development
As with the original MegaSquirt EFI system the MegaSquirt 2 is an open source project allowing anyone to customize the hardware and code to meet different needs. Already there are several customizations in the works to be released in the future. Rumor has it that the MSnS-E code will be ported over to the MS2 in the not-too-distant future.

Mekkahfire · 07-02-2006, 03:15 PM

So nobody in the MR2 community including all the tuners that get on here have any oppinion on the megasquirt?

PETC · 07-02-2006, 05:49 PM

Tons and tons and tons of people use Megasquirt. Works for them. Driven in and driven cars and worked on cars that have all used Megasquirt. It's a good system for the money if you know what you're doing.

Loki · 07-02-2006, 08:43 PM

I've been curious to try one of these, but as of yet have no first hand experience. I'm tempted by the price, as I'm sure most other people are, to give it a try.

Mekkahfire · 07-02-2006, 09:28 PM

I know a guy with a fully race-built Neon R/T turbo thats running this EMS, and hes running 11.80 supposidly.

Luni · 07-03-2006, 12:50 AM

Ive still never seen one hooked up to a 3SGTE properly. I know its been done, nobody just bothered to post about it.

Raptor13x · 07-03-2006, 01:14 AM

http://www.megasquirt.info/v22manual/mintro.htm

http://www.msefi.com/index.php?c=2

Mekkahfire · 07-03-2006, 02:09 PM

okay?

Enthalpy · 07-03-2006, 11:29 PM

I have experience. I have done a 20-valve 4A, a 3S-GTE and a BMW motorcycle (alpha-N).

There are, of course, hidden costs. If you want to run sequential injection, you need their latest box, and you need to build a signal conditioner. I have yet to see a stock trigger work with them, even with all of this.

If you want real-life IAT compensation, forget it.

Their Accel enrichment is a bit of a joke.

It is open-sourced, but don't let that fool you. You will be SERIOUSLY hardware-limited! If you are a half-way decent coder, you need to be REALLY good at REALLY tight main loops. This even applies to their newer boxes.

You build it (unless you use a service that does it for you). Either way, you have a hand-made piece of electronics, which is never as reliable as manufacturer-built.

Basically, you get what you pay for.

BATz31 · 07-04-2006, 05:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kiddquikk

I know a guy with a fully race-built Neon R/T turbo thats running this EMS, and hes running 11.80 supposidly.

Where does this guy live? I know of a guy who has the exact same setup and runs consistant 12's. Primer black neon. pretty sick....

But what he has demonstrated to me is that mega squirt works well. I wanted to go with it a while ago for my Z. But didnt want to mess around with putting it all together...

Mekkahfire · 07-04-2006, 07:57 PM

His is black, but not primer black. He lives in ohio.

Mekkahfire · 07-04-2006, 07:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Enthalpy

I have experience. I have done a 20-valve 4A, a 3S-GTE and a BMW motorcycle (alpha-N).

There are, of course, hidden costs. If you want to run sequential injection, you need their latest box, and you need to build a signal conditioner. I have yet to see a stock trigger work with them, even with all of this.

If you want real-life IAT compensation, forget it.

Their Accel enrichment is a bit of a joke.

It is open-sourced, but don't let that fool you. You will be SERIOUSLY hardware-limited! If you are a half-way decent coder, you need to be REALLY good at REALLY tight main loops. This even applies to their newer boxes.

You build it (unless you use a service that does it for you). Either way, you have a hand-made piece of electronics, which is never as reliable as manufacturer-built.

Basically, you get what you pay for.

Im sorry, explain 'squential injection' to me

Enthalpy · 07-04-2006, 09:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BATz31

Where does this guy live? I know of a guy who has the exact same setup and runs consistant 12's. Primer black neon. pretty sick....

But what he has demonstrated to me is that mega squirt works well. I wanted to go with it a while ago for my Z. But didnt want to mess around with putting it all together...

Any EMS will handle peak power runs pretty much the same. What separates the men from the boys is mileage, emissions, engine response, knock response, the ability to run the SAME in ANY weather and altitude, and the like.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kiddquikk

Im sorry, explain 'squential injection' to me

Sure. Batch injection is where all the injectors fire once (or twice) per engine cycle (2 crankshaft revs). Sequential, on the other hand, is where you time each injector to fire with the opening of that cylinder's intake valve. In a sequential system, each injector fires independantly of the others.

This only works if you have:
-Port injection (one injector per cylinder, ideally pointed right on the intake valve)
-A trigger pattern that includes a position and a synch. In the stock Turbo MR2, that's all handled by 3 triggers in the distributor.

The advantages of such a system are:
-Better emissions
-Better mileage
-Better engine response

Weasy2k · 07-04-2006, 10:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Enthalpy

I have experience. I have done a 20-valve 4A, a 3S-GTE and a BMW motorcycle (alpha-N).

There are, of course, hidden costs. If you want to run sequential injection, you need their latest box, and you need to build a signal conditioner. I have yet to see a stock trigger work with them, even with all of this.

If you want real-life IAT compensation, forget it.

Their Accel enrichment is a bit of a joke.

It is open-sourced, but don't let that fool you. You will be SERIOUSLY hardware-limited! If you are a half-way decent coder, you need to be REALLY good at REALLY tight main loops. This even applies to their newer boxes.

You build it (unless you use a service that does it for you). Either way, you have a hand-made piece of electronics, which is never as reliable as manufacturer-built.

Basically, you get what you pay for.

A freakn men!

That is just what i try to explain to people...they think it’s all cheap but its not what it seems. I did a install on a customers rabbit and it ended up costing more then a manufactured unit would have and recently he had to remove the ecu to get it repaired as the soldering fell apart.

Enthalpy · 07-05-2006, 12:49 PM

I think you and I tuned cars together at the same shop in a previous life, Weasy.

Weasy2k · 07-08-2006, 10:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Enthalpy

I think you and I tuned cars together at the same shop in a previous life, Weasy.

Im sure i was the apprentice.

I mean MS&S is a pretty good setup it’s just too bad that they are not as reliable as people think they are. I mean I have seen lots of great setups but having the risk of messed up "code" and poor craftsmanship keeps me away.

Enthalpy · 07-08-2006, 12:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Weasy2k

Im sure i was the apprentice.

Naw, you know your stuff!

Mekkahfire · 07-09-2006, 03:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Weasy2k

A freakn men!

That is just what i try to explain to people...they think it’s all cheap but its not what it seems. I did a install on a customers rabbit and it ended up costing more then a manufactured unit would have and recently he had to remove the ecu to get it repaired as the soldering fell apart.

The soldering has nothing to do with the manufacturer, as you solder this product yourself.

07-01-2006, 02:01 AM	#1 (permalink)
Mekkahfire Gone But Not Forgotten Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Westerville OH Posts: 1,359 Thanks: 9 Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts iTrader Rating: (2/75% )	Opinions on the "Mega-Squirt" EMS? : Ongoing MegaSquirt Discussion Ive been reading a lot on this "mega squirt" EMS which only runs 200-300 dollars. Its all open source programming written in C++, so its completely modifyable, you assemble it all yourself (soddering resistors, etc), and you make your own wiring harness. I met a guy tonight at a local car meet who has this on his 2.0L dodge neon. Hes running a F350 Turbo deisel tubo on his neon and using the mega squirt squeezed 315 horsepower at the wheels at 13psi. And from what i saw, its very responsive to the laptop hes got it connected to. Tuners: any oppinions on it??????

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07-01-2006, 12:08 PM	#2 (permalink)
Raptor13x Legendary Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Farmington Hills, MI Posts: 3,987 Thanks: 7 Thanked 40 Times in 34 Posts My Google Map iTrader Rating: (5/100% )	I actually have one, but I've never ended up using it. (yet) The MS is definately an excellent EMS for the money, but it doesn't have a lot of the features and support that the more expensive systems have. You can download the tuning program for free and play around with it if you want. There's also some forums devoted to it.

07-01-2006, 02:08 PM	#3 (permalink)
Mekkahfire Gone But Not Forgotten Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Westerville OH Posts: 1,359 Thanks: 9 Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts iTrader Rating: (2/75% )	Heres some more info on it that i researched.. The MegaSquirt 2 Standalone EMS is the latest product from Bowling and Grippo. Truly the dream ECU computer for the DIYer. This latest rendition can control fuel, ignition, stepper motor IAC, and more for your turbo, supercharged, or naturally aspirated engine. More information about MegaSquirt-II can be found at http://www.megasquirt.info/ms2. MegaSquirt II includes all of the features and benefits of the original... Onboard MAP sensor for NA or boosted engines up to 21psi! Speed density or Alpha-N. Use any injector - High or Low impedance. Compatible with output from narrowband and wideband O2 sensors. Log data on your laptop for later analysis. Tuning software is free for download and regularly updated with new features. Open Source design - all code and hardware information is available online. Includes proper female DB37 connector and shell for your wiring harness. Additional Features new to the MegaSquirt-II 24 MHz HCS12 processor, Fuel control to 1 µsec (100 times more resolution than MegaSquirt-I), Ignition control (full spark timing advance control, dwell control, etc) for one coil/distributor (7 pin HEI for example) and Ford's EDIS systems, On-board stepper motor driver for IAC stepper control (this requires a few jumpers to be added on the MegaSquirt PCB to connect the socket jumpers to the DB37 connector), Ford PWM idle valve support, Built-in rev limiter, either 'fuel cut' or 'spark retard', All tables are now 12×12 in size, WBO2 AFR target table (in AFR units), Independent dual-tables for VE and AFR target, EGO feedback in wide-band mode is proportional to the difference between the measured AFR and the target AFR, the bigger the difference, the bigger the feedback step, Spark advance table can have different rpm and kpa bins than VE and AFR tables, 115,200 baud serial interface with MegaTune2.25+, CANbus networking Barometric correction amount and direction configurable in software, and provisions for: barometric correction based on initial MAP reading, independent 2nd barometric MAP sensor for continuous real-time baro correction, or no baro correction. TPS values for open loop and flood clear mode are user configurable, MAP based open loop can be set as well as TPS, Both TPS and MAP based accel enrichment is built into the code, you can configure the ratio of each, Blended Alpha-N and speed density is an option, 2 spare I/O lines for custom controls. (This is in addition to 4 lines for Idle stepper control if you don't need this, or the Fast idle solenoid then becomes a spare if you do use a stepper motor.) DIYAutoTune Kits and Completed Units also Feature: Extruded Aluminum case with CNC machined flanged ends for easy mounting and a perfect fit! The crystal and all nuts are glued in place to reduce sensitivity to vibrations. (Completed units) Open Source means Endless Development As with the original MegaSquirt EFI system the MegaSquirt 2 is an open source project allowing anyone to customize the hardware and code to meet different needs. Already there are several customizations in the works to be released in the future. Rumor has it that the MSnS-E code will be ported over to the MS2 in the not-too-distant future.

07-02-2006, 03:15 PM	#4 (permalink)
Mekkahfire Gone But Not Forgotten Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Westerville OH Posts: 1,359 Thanks: 9 Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts iTrader Rating: (2/75% )	So nobody in the MR2 community including all the tuners that get on here have any oppinion on the megasquirt?

07-02-2006, 05:49 PM	#5 (permalink)
PETC √(176400) Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Bellingham, WA Posts: 2,410 Thanks: 27 Thanked 52 Times in 45 Posts My Google Map iTrader Rating: (4/100% )	Tons and tons and tons of people use Megasquirt. Works for them. Driven in and driven cars and worked on cars that have all used Megasquirt. It's a good system for the money if you know what you're doing.

07-02-2006, 08:43 PM	#6 (permalink)
Loki KO Racing Dude Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Hillsboro, OR Posts: 104 Thanks: 3 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post My Google Map iTrader Rating: (3/100% )	I've been curious to try one of these, but as of yet have no first hand experience. I'm tempted by the price, as I'm sure most other people are, to give it a try.

07-02-2006, 09:28 PM	#7 (permalink)
Mekkahfire Gone But Not Forgotten Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Westerville OH Posts: 1,359 Thanks: 9 Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts iTrader Rating: (2/75% )	I know a guy with a fully race-built Neon R/T turbo thats running this EMS, and hes running 11.80 supposidly.

07-03-2006, 12:50 AM	#8 (permalink)
Luni ST185 Powered SW20 Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Salt Lake City Utah Posts: 2,959 Thanks: 9 Thanked 106 Times in 92 Posts My Google Map iTrader Rating: (8/100% )	Ive still never seen one hooked up to a 3SGTE properly. I know its been done, nobody just bothered to post about it.

07-03-2006, 01:14 AM	#9 (permalink)
Raptor13x Legendary Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Farmington Hills, MI Posts: 3,987 Thanks: 7 Thanked 40 Times in 34 Posts My Google Map iTrader Rating: (5/100% )	http://www.megasquirt.info/v22manual/mintro.htm http://www.msefi.com/index.php?c=2

07-03-2006, 02:09 PM	#10 (permalink)
Mekkahfire Gone But Not Forgotten Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Westerville OH Posts: 1,359 Thanks: 9 Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts iTrader Rating: (2/75% )	okay?

07-03-2006, 11:29 PM	#11 (permalink)
Enthalpy EMS Harmonizer Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Denver, CO Posts: 1,219 Thanks: 8 Thanked 54 Times in 42 Posts My Google Map iTrader Rating: (2/100% )	I have experience. I have done a 20-valve 4A, a 3S-GTE and a BMW motorcycle (alpha-N). There are, of course, hidden costs. If you want to run sequential injection, you need their latest box, and you need to build a signal conditioner. I have yet to see a stock trigger work with them, even with all of this. If you want real-life IAT compensation, forget it. Their Accel enrichment is a bit of a joke. It is open-sourced, but don't let that fool you. You will be SERIOUSLY hardware-limited! If you are a half-way decent coder, you need to be REALLY good at REALLY tight main loops. This even applies to their newer boxes. You build it (unless you use a service that does it for you). Either way, you have a hand-made piece of electronics, which is never as reliable as manufacturer-built. Basically, you get what you pay for.

07-04-2006, 07:57 PM	#13 (permalink)
Mekkahfire Gone But Not Forgotten Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Westerville OH Posts: 1,359 Thanks: 9 Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts iTrader Rating: (2/75% )	His is black, but not primer black. He lives in ohio.

07-05-2006, 12:49 PM	#17 (permalink)
Enthalpy EMS Harmonizer Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Denver, CO Posts: 1,219 Thanks: 8 Thanked 54 Times in 42 Posts My Google Map iTrader Rating: (2/100% )	I think you and I tuned cars together at the same shop in a previous life, Weasy.