3SGTE: Apexi Power FC or AEM EMS?

[mr2slo4u]

Originally Posted by baktasht

The Nemesis comes will al the sensors you need, including the intake temp sensor which is fairly important, and a built in MAP sensor. Not sure what the Haltech comes with. Other than that, I'm sure you can find feature lists of both on their respective websites to compare.

The Haltech is now a PNP unit that comes with a base map and has a built in 3 bar map sensor or optional 4bar for just an extra $30. And I'm sure once you go with the Haltech you will never have to PAY for updates or revisions, Just simply download the updates/firmware. At the moment I'm torn between the pnp Haltech E8, AEM and Apex PowerFC.

Harness the power and flexibility of the Haltech E8 in a simple-to-install plug-and-play system for the Toyota MR2 and Celica All-trac! The plug-and-play interface box comes prewired for your application for 1990-1998 USDM and JDM models (please specify your application in the order comments section, we'll preconfigure the internal jumpers for your wiring setup).

The Haltech E8 is packed with more features than any ECU in its class by more than just a quarter mile. The all new E8 performance ECU is for those who are on a budget and need full sequential control for their engine.

The Haltech E8 ECU is an ECU capable of controlling sequential injection on 2 and 4 cylinder with semi sequential 6 and 8 cylinder applications. With 8 channels capable of controlling injection and ignition duties, the E8 can support most modern engines with multi-coil ignition systems, as well as conventional distributor ignition systems.In addition to controlling fuel and spark, the E8 can control various auxiliary engine functions.

* Stepper motor and BAC/IAC closed loop Idle Control
* Closed loop boost control
* Soft cut rev limiter
* Tuning via TPS with Manifold pressure correction - Ideal for those multi-throttle body
turbo cars such as, GTiR Pulsars and GTR Skylines.
* O2 sensor closed loop mixture control
* 32x32 mapping structure
* On board data logging (up to 200 samples per second)
* User definable mapping points
* Numerous correction maps to ensure smooth drivability under varying operating conditions
* Windows Software
* The ability to calibrate just about any sensor for OEM applications and of course all the usual outputs you would expect to find in a Haltech engine management system.

Click here to read more about the latest Halwin software used to program the E8 ECU.
Typical Applications:

* Control of fuel injection on modified engines
* Conversion from carburetion to fuel injection
* Race and rally applications of all description
* Design and development purposes
* Educational use by universities and technical colleges
* Original equipment in cars and motorcycles

The E8 includes:
ECU Programmable Computer, Programming Cable, Programming CD, Instruction Manual (on CD).
The MR2 PNP application adds:

* 3SGTE plug and play wiring harness
* Built-in 3-bar MAP sensor and included MAT sensor to convert to speed-density and get rid of the factory AFM. (4-bar sensor optional) -$30.
* 3SGTE base map*

[Sonic]

Originally Posted by mr2slo4u

The Haltech is now a PNP unit that comes with a base map and has a built in 3 bar map sensor or optional 4bar for just an extra $30. And I'm sure once you go with the Haltech you will never have to PAY for updates or revisions, Just simply download the updates/firmware. At the moment I'm torn between the pnp Haltech E8, AEM and Apex PowerFC.

I'm a huge fan of the Nemesis, but I have to say, the Haltech is looking really good right now (price, feature, options, etc). The only thing the Haltech is missing is RickyB. <LOL!>

[RickyB]

Originally Posted by mr2slo4u

The Haltech is now a PNP unit that comes with a base map and has a built in 3 bar map sensor or optional 4bar for just an extra $30. And I'm sure once you go with the Haltech you will never have to PAY for updates or revisions, Just simply download the updates/firmware. At the moment I'm torn between the pnp Haltech E8, AEM and Apex PowerFC.

I've heard good things about the Haltech E8 from tuners I respect. No one has brought me one to tune yet, so playing with the interface is all I've been able to do. It would be my choice over the other two. The AEM is known by many tuners, but the support is not great and even if you get through to a real person it is not a person who knows much about the MR2 in specific. The PFC is a nice little unit for a good price, but it is very simple and lacks even the most basic knock response features. Still, all these units will run the car well provided they are properly tuned.

I don't make my customers pay for any upgrades I feel are essential. When they do upgrade, I hand convert their maps to the new version myself to insure that they work properly on the first try. I often avoid doing "simple" upgrades on other systems because all too often you end up having to figure out how to get back to the same running state you started with. There's nothing more frustrating than doing a firmware upgrade and then spending several hours trying to figure out what you need to change to get the car to start again. There was one beauty of an upgrade a good while back on the AEM that automagically set the rev limit value sky high regardless of what the older version had. That made for a very eventfull first dyno pull on the Supra I was tuning at the time. That kind of "convenience" I can do without

[kblake]

Originally Posted by RickyB

There was one beauty of an upgrade a good while back on the AEM that automagically set the rev limit value sky high regardless of what the older version had. That made for a very eventfull first dyno pull on the Supra I was tuning at the time.

You're the only tuner I've met that completes a dyno pull by hitting the rev limiter.

[RickyB]

Originally Posted by kblake

You're the only tuner I've met that completes a dyno pull by hitting the rev limiter.

Pretty much every tuner I know does. How can you tune at the rev limit unless you go right to it?

[kblake]

Originally Posted by RickyB

Pretty much every tuner I know does. How can you tune at the rev limit unless you go right to it?

On the first pull?

[RickyB]

Originally Posted by kblake

On the first pull?

That wasn't the first pull. I upgraded the firmware only because I was trying to resolve another issue and AEM support requested that I do so.

Do I pull to the rev limiter on the first pull in general? That depends. I almost always do load tuning up to a couple psi before doing a single pull. It dials in the off-boost fuel and gives me a very good idea of how much fuel the car is going to need at the lowest wastegate spring boost level. Most of the time the first pull has a very reasonable AFR and no hint of detonation on the stethoscope. If that is the case, I go until I feel the limiter to get the most information I can from the run. If I see the AFR going lean or hear anything more than the smallest ping of detonation on the first pull, the foot immediately comes off the gas.

[kblake]

Originally Posted by RickyB

That wasn't the first pull. I upgraded the firmware only because I was trying to resolve another issue and AEM support requested that I do so.

Ok. You previously said it was the first pull, which is why I questioned it:

Originally Posted by RickyB

There was one beauty of an upgrade a good while back on the AEM that automagically set the rev limit value sky high regardless of what the older version had. That made for a very eventfull first dyno pull on the Supra I was tuning at the time. That kind of "convenience" I can do without

[mr2andy]

Hey guys...
I know this thread is few months old.. but I am also deciding which EMS to go for. I was first looking at the AEM and it all looks good to me... then I read this thread about the Haltec E8 which I'm not sure why Ricky and some of you would prefer the Haltec E8 over the AEM.

I know the Haltec E8 is capable of controlling more than one(total 4) Ignition output.. and I didn't read anything from AEM side about that and not sure if AEM support more than one...

other than the ignition... AEM looks better spec'wise... I didn't compare the software though..

Can anyone feed me more information between these two EMSs?

Cheers
andy

[alamoryan]

give Brice a call at Alamo Autosports in Arlington 817-860-4300, he can tune any standalone, it is what he is known for. Depending on how far you want to go with your car will be the deciding factor for which one to get. He also has alot of experience with the Haltech, even more with the Aem. I personally run an Aem, if i had a race car and not a street car i would have Haltech e11v2 or an e8. For ease of install and support(as in tuners) the Aem would be your best choice, that way there is more than 3 people in the world that are knowledgable with your system.

[mr2andy]

Thank Ryan..
i'll give Brice a call whenever possible..

What about Hydra though? Hope RickyB is still following this thread.. I want to know why Hydra over AEM and Haltech as well..

I mean no harm guys....

[lostMR2inGuam]

I am also in the market for an EMS. Only problem is....
is that i am located in Guam and we are seriously short on tuners and dyno's here.
If i go with either or EMS then wat is the likely hood of other tuners helping me with base maps and tuning maps?
Any help with the information would be greatly appreciated.

[mr2andy]

How much modification you have done on your engine?

RickyB will definitely able to help if you go for Hydra....

[lostMR2inGuam]

i will definitely be going with koracin for the turbo kit
and chances are i will go to jun auto for the rest of the internals

[hell_rider]

so have you installed an EMS ? i always thought it depends on the use of your car .. If i were to choose for my car an EMS i would go for the Power FC or the AEM although the AEM has a huge difference in price . Also where im from we only have 2-3 tuners and they are not at all familiar with the Nemesis or Haltech . I was actually concidering a piggy back because my car is for street use and the E-manage Ultimate has alot of nice basic features + the launch control + half the price of the Power FC .