3S-GTE USDM Turbo Engine CT27 or CT20B?

AlecB · 09-18-2009, 07:26 PM

So I have looked long and hard at all of my options, and in general most people seem to be advocates of the ct27 upgrade as well as the ct20b. I am shooting for around 260-280whp on full boost and was wondering what people thought as far as which is the better option? my main concerns are obviously reliability, driveability and longevity.. I have been leaning towards ct20b due primarily to the fact that it is a stock turbo and direct bolt on. opinions? also i know the stock fuel system is supposed to be o.k. (with no more than 275ish hp) but is that number really reliable or is it pushing the limit?

mr.ac · 09-20-2009, 01:12 AM

I would go with the ct20b.

mattdouken · 10-18-2009, 06:13 PM

bump, I want to know the same thing.

Bak@EMSPowered · 10-18-2009, 07:04 PM

Depends on your budget and your goals. If you're trying to keep it cheap. If the price is your main concern the ct27 and ct20b both do fine and will give you similar power/spool. The ct20b has a ceramic turbine, is fragile, and may get damaged easily with a little detonation. The ct27 is a rebuilt turbo, and with rebuilds there's always a good chance that the life of the turbo will be shorter than what you'd get with a new turbo.

If price is not the main concern, there's turbo kits around that will spool up as quickly as the ct20b/ct27 and produce the same and more power, and will last longer since you're getting a new turbo.

dallsbeep · 10-20-2009, 10:51 AM

What do you recommend baktasht? I really need to come into your store and BS sometime, being in austin and all.

Bak@EMSPowered · 10-20-2009, 12:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dallsbeep

What do you recommend baktasht? I really need to come into your store and BS sometime, being in austin and all.

really depends on what sort of power goals you have. Personally I dont think there's anything better than our new turbo kit on the market right now. Nobody else uses a stainless steel turbine yet, flex sections in their downpipes, nobody elses turbo kit allows use of the stock heatshield, nobody else includes a 2 year warranty with their turbo kit. There's just simply no other that comes close. Give it 2 years, I'm sure other companies will start to imitate our kit in different ways by then

We can set up our new turbo kit to support anywhere from 300whp all the way up to around 600whp. Shoot me a message or give me a ring if you have any questions.

Bak@EMSPowered · 10-20-2009, 01:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by baktasht

really depends on what sort of power goals you have. Personally I dont think there's anything better than our new turbo kit on the market right now. Nobody else uses a stainless steel turbine yet, flex sections in their downpipes, nobody elses turbo kit allows use of the stock heatshield, nobody else includes a 2 year warranty with their turbo kit. There's just simply no other that comes close. Give it 2 years, I'm sure other companies will start to imitate our kit in different ways by then

We can set up our new turbo kit to support anywhere from 300whp all the way up to around 600whp. Shoot me a message or give me a ring if you have any questions.

Here for info: http://www.mr2.com/forums/ems-powere...ming-soon.html

RePete · 10-20-2009, 04:30 PM

Wow, what a plug...

I don't have experience with the CT27, I usually avoid rebuilds but perhaps not in this case because I've heard a lot of good things about it from many owners.

But the PO of my car installed a CT20B on my SW20 and I do know the car is much faster than my previous two turbos. There's barely any delay in spool time compared to my last two MR2s and it doesn't gasp at redline nearly as much. It behaves more like my Supercharged '2 off the throttle too. Since it's an OEM Toyota part, I have every confidence in its reliability.

Bak@EMSPowered · 10-20-2009, 04:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RePete

Wow, what a plug...

I don't have experience with the CT27, I usually avoid rebuilds but perhaps not in this case because I've heard a lot of good things about it from many owners.

But the PO of my car installed a CT20B on my SW20 and I do know the car is much faster than my previous two turbos. There's barely any delay in spool time compared to my last two MR2s and it doesn't gasp at redline nearly as much. It behaves more like my Supercharged '2 off the throttle too. Since it's an OEM Toyota part, I have every confidence in its reliability.

The CT20b is a good turbo. As I stated a few posts up, the main fallback of the CT20b is that it's turbine wheel is fragile and can easily shatter if your detonate enough.

lucky_charms · 10-20-2009, 04:53 PM

so did anybody finaly get a price on tha emspowered turbo kit

Bak@EMSPowered · 10-20-2009, 05:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lucky_charms

so did anybody finaly get a price on tha emspowered turbo kit

Funny you ask. I just posted it a few minutes ago: http://www.mr2.com/forums/ems-powere...tml#post500198

mattdouken · 10-20-2009, 05:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by baktasht

Funny you ask. I just posted it a few minutes ago: http://www.mr2.com/forums/ems-powere...tml#post500198

baktasht how much longer are your downpipes and exhaust going to be on sale?

Sang · 10-20-2009, 06:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by baktasht

Nobody else uses a stainless steel turbine yet, flex sections in their downpipes, nobody elses turbo kit allows use of the stock heatshield, nobody else includes a 2 year warranty with their turbo kit.

...

Bak@EMSPowered · 10-20-2009, 11:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mattdouken

baktasht how much longer are your downpipes and exhaust going to be on sale?

Right now they're on sale through the end of this month.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sang

...

Sang, was that a question?

Sang · 10-27-2009, 02:19 AM

I'm not sure if you meant to say that your kit is the only one to incorporate all of these into one, but there are a few kits out there that does have flex's in their downpipe (long before berk did it btw), and others that retain the stock heatshield. Perhaps it's just the way you word your posts when plugging your kit, but it sounds like your undermining previous innovators of these ideas when you imply that you're kit is the only one that has these features.

Bak@EMSPowered · 10-27-2009, 12:33 PM

I don't know of any other current kits that allow you to retain the stock heatshield without lots of cutting. And I don't know of any other current kits that use a flex in the downpipe. Berk's CT26/20b downpipe has a flex in it, but that's not really a kit, thats just a downpipe.

There's nothing innovative about any of this. I'm not undermining anyone. It's just a matter of cost and profit margin. Other's just don't do certain things because it costs them more and they want to leave more room for profit margin. At the end of the day it's just a turbo and a downpipe and a wastegate. You can move them around as much as you'd like and add and remove parts, but there's nothing innovative about it.

Skidmark · 10-27-2009, 12:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by baktasht

I don't know of any other current kits that allow you to retain the stock heatshield without lots of cutting. And I don't know of any other current kits that use a flex in the downpipe. Berk's CT26/20b downpipe has a flex in it, but that's not really a kit, thats just a downpipe.

I have a Berk GT28RS kit - it has a flex in the downpipe and all I did was drill one hole in the stock heatshield for the top oil feed line to make it fit.

Bak@EMSPowered · 10-27-2009, 12:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skidmark

I have a Berk GT28RS kit - it has a flex in the downpipe and all I did was drill one hole in the stock heatshield for the top oil feed line to make it fit.

I stand corrected. I didnt know their gt28 kit has a flex in the downpipe. All of them are good kits. It's just a matter of included features, price, which turbo you want and what sort of performance you're looking for.

Skidmark · 10-27-2009, 01:03 PM

Back to the thread topic, I chose the GT28 because of reliability. Yes, it costs a lot more, but reading about the 20B's ceramic turbines breaking and the potential engine damage it could cause me made it worth the price for me. I've also read about 27's failing very quickly, so going through 2 CT27's with R&R labor almost adds up to the price of a new GT28.

Black93Hardtop · 10-27-2009, 06:49 PM

Well they are both very simular turbo's The CT27 seems to be hit or miss with the reliability. Usually if they are going to fail, they do so rather quickly (within the warranty period) but I think most last a good long time. The 20B is a good choice but the ceramic turbine wheel can just shatter. They are picky and your $600 used turbo can become a paperweight very quick. Remember the CT20b is not rebuildable (so I've read). My vote is the CT27. I was in a simular position and actually owned a 20b but decided to sell it in favor of the CT27. Good luck either way you go.

Thanks,
Brian

09-18-2009, 07:26 PM	#1 (permalink)
AlecB No Skills Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Chicago, Il. Posts: 21 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts iTrader Rating: (0/0% )	CT27 or CT20B? So I have looked long and hard at all of my options, and in general most people seem to be advocates of the ct27 upgrade as well as the ct20b. I am shooting for around 260-280whp on full boost and was wondering what people thought as far as which is the better option? my main concerns are obviously reliability, driveability and longevity.. I have been leaning towards ct20b due primarily to the fact that it is a stock turbo and direct bolt on. opinions? also i know the stock fuel system is supposed to be o.k. (with no more than 275ish hp) but is that number really reliable or is it pushing the limit?

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09-20-2009, 01:12 AM	#2 (permalink)
mr.ac Just Say NO to Snorkes Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Central Coast, CA Posts: 388 Thanks: 0 Thanked 19 Times in 18 Posts iTrader Rating: (1/100% )	I would go with the ct20b.

10-18-2009, 06:13 PM	#3 (permalink)
mattdouken Driver Of The Seven Sea's Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Greensboro,NC Posts: 701 Thanks: 53 Thanked 29 Times in 18 Posts iTrader Rating: (9/100% )	bump, I want to know the same thing.

10-18-2009, 07:04 PM	#4 (permalink)
Bak@EMSPowered Banned Seller Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Austin, TX Posts: 5,925 Thanks: 30 Thanked 193 Times in 165 Posts My Google Map iTrader Rating: (49/93% )	Depends on your budget and your goals. If you're trying to keep it cheap. If the price is your main concern the ct27 and ct20b both do fine and will give you similar power/spool. The ct20b has a ceramic turbine, is fragile, and may get damaged easily with a little detonation. The ct27 is a rebuilt turbo, and with rebuilds there's always a good chance that the life of the turbo will be shorter than what you'd get with a new turbo. If price is not the main concern, there's turbo kits around that will spool up as quickly as the ct20b/ct27 and produce the same and more power, and will last longer since you're getting a new turbo.

10-20-2009, 10:51 AM	#5 (permalink)
dallsbeep Some Skills Join Date: May 2009 Posts: 65 Thanks: 1 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post iTrader Rating: (0/0% )	What do you recommend baktasht? I really need to come into your store and BS sometime, being in austin and all.

10-20-2009, 04:30 PM	#8 (permalink)
RePete No Frills Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Western Canada Posts: 3,897 Thanks: 0 Thanked 254 Times in 244 Posts Blog Entries: 4 iTrader Rating: (3/100% )	Wow, what a plug... I don't have experience with the CT27, I usually avoid rebuilds but perhaps not in this case because I've heard a lot of good things about it from many owners. But the PO of my car installed a CT20B on my SW20 and I do know the car is much faster than my previous two turbos. There's barely any delay in spool time compared to my last two MR2s and it doesn't gasp at redline nearly as much. It behaves more like my Supercharged '2 off the throttle too. Since it's an OEM Toyota part, I have every confidence in its reliability.

10-20-2009, 04:53 PM	#10 (permalink)
lucky_charms custom Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: moving back to tpa fl thank god Posts: 442 Thanks: 10 Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts My Google Map iTrader Rating: (-1/0% )	so did anybody finaly get a price on tha emspowered turbo kit

10-27-2009, 02:19 AM	#15 (permalink)
Sang Turtle Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: FL Posts: 4,096 Thanks: 18 Thanked 267 Times in 246 Posts iTrader Rating: (5/100% )	I'm not sure if you meant to say that your kit is the only one to incorporate all of these into one, but there are a few kits out there that does have flex's in their downpipe (long before berk did it btw), and others that retain the stock heatshield. Perhaps it's just the way you word your posts when plugging your kit, but it sounds like your undermining previous innovators of these ideas when you imply that you're kit is the only one that has these features.

10-27-2009, 12:33 PM	#16 (permalink)
Bak@EMSPowered Banned Seller Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Austin, TX Posts: 5,925 Thanks: 30 Thanked 193 Times in 165 Posts My Google Map iTrader Rating: (49/93% )	I don't know of any other current kits that allow you to retain the stock heatshield without lots of cutting. And I don't know of any other current kits that use a flex in the downpipe. Berk's CT26/20b downpipe has a flex in it, but that's not really a kit, thats just a downpipe. There's nothing innovative about any of this. I'm not undermining anyone. It's just a matter of cost and profit margin. Other's just don't do certain things because it costs them more and they want to leave more room for profit margin. At the end of the day it's just a turbo and a downpipe and a wastegate. You can move them around as much as you'd like and add and remove parts, but there's nothing innovative about it.

10-27-2009, 01:03 PM	#19 (permalink)
Skidmark No Skills Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 28 Thanks: 0 Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts iTrader Rating: (0/0% )	Back to the thread topic, I chose the GT28 because of reliability. Yes, it costs a lot more, but reading about the 20B's ceramic turbines breaking and the potential engine damage it could cause me made it worth the price for me. I've also read about 27's failing very quickly, so going through 2 CT27's with R&R labor almost adds up to the price of a new GT28.

10-27-2009, 06:49 PM	#20 (permalink)
Black93Hardtop Rare 93' Hardtop Turbo Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Indiana Posts: 152 Thanks: 0 Thanked 4 Times in 4 Posts iTrader Rating: (3/100% )	Well they are both very simular turbo's The CT27 seems to be hit or miss with the reliability. Usually if they are going to fail, they do so rather quickly (within the warranty period) but I think most last a good long time. The 20B is a good choice but the ceramic turbine wheel can just shatter. They are picky and your $600 used turbo can become a paperweight very quick. Remember the CT20b is not rebuildable (so I've read). My vote is the CT27. I was in a simular position and actually owned a 20b but decided to sell it in favor of the CT27. Good luck either way you go. Thanks, Brian