3VZFE vs 5VZFE... Debate!!! - Page 6

ixtlann · 03-15-2008, 06:18 AM

Yeah those 5vz z are pretty tuff on gas milage, I wonder how much better the 3vz fe s and 1mzfe s are in that respect

VeilsideMR2 · 03-27-2008, 10:37 AM

good question...

SnowRocker88 · 04-19-2008, 07:34 PM

I have to say 5VZ-FE seeing as it's factory mapped for 6psi boost and has the TRD charger as a potential, standard bolt-on, option...

hfmt93 · 04-20-2008, 01:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ixtlann

Yeah those 5vz z are pretty tuff on gas milage, I wonder how much better the 3vz fe s and 1mzfe s are in that respect

I have a 92' automatic camry with 220,000 miles on it and get about 20 mpg around town and with a heavy foot.

The mr2 is lighter but because of the gearing i would speculate that the interstate mpg is not going to be that great, but around town should be much better.

Toysrme · 04-29-2008, 12:08 AM

can't speak the 5vz in mr2's.

i can say that in he camry/es world that all mz blocks get 1mpg average and 2mpg highway better than the 3vz-fe's, and the latest vvt-i's slightly better thn that (but almost none can actually average 30mpg highway. A/T gearing is a hair too high)
be the mpg increase from engine tweaks, transmission / torque convertor tweaks, or overall slightly decreasing .cd VS frontal area over time i can't tell ya. not something i would honestly worry about myself.

personally i feel if people worry about >5mpg in performance cars they shouldn't consider any swap. grab an old cheap stock NA or a miata or something & stick with 30mpg+.

Gimpster · 04-29-2008, 01:10 AM

Couple years ago I'd agree with you, but in a world where gas is $4.00+ per gallon- the mo' MPG the betta. I think we all know this isn't some temporary "spike" like they'd have you believe.

It's here to stay.

It certainly woke me up. I sold one of my trucks and bought a Yaris liftback.

U-235 · 04-29-2008, 01:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gimpster

Couple years ago I'd agree with you, but in a world where gas is $4.00+ per gallon- the mo' MPG the betta. I think we all know this isn't some temporary "spike" like they'd have you believe.

It's here to stay.

It certainly woke me up. I sold one of my trucks and bought a Yaris liftback.

I somewhat agree. The MR2 is my fun car/spare, so I'm not concerned with fuel economy so much. That being said... My 5VZ is still in the queue of my machinist for inspection.

However, I feel your pain- I sold my Integra for a Jetta TDi.

The Jetta is nice, and I probably would've done it later on, but it just ate my swap fund alive. I said it before- priorities suck.

boostd4 · 04-29-2008, 02:08 PM

So there is a P&P EMS by Hydra for the 5VZ right? If that's the case, gas mileage really shouldn't be an issue. With a wideband and some time I'm sure you could tune part throttle cruising to get 25mpg+... I'd bet your mixed results would still be above 20mpg.

Toysrme · 04-29-2008, 02:28 PM

my only point was that gas is a small price to pay for nothing but a toy.
we never use our F150(and its a horrible vehicle), or lexus because of gas. Only when when we MUST have the bed. otherwise it's all 88-89 civic hatch here for a daily.
The F150 is a once a day, every other week thing until we need it. The lexus is my date car, and the civic is the daily driver... 40-70mpg (pulse and glide owns) beats 20mpg tops for the lexus, beats 17mpg average on the truck.

shoot, 8 years ago as a teenager when I was flying my first IMAA scale R/C plane 30% nitro-methanol was $13/g for it and i was burning a 1/4 gallon every 15-20min of flying. but its a toy. you can either suck it up and fly, or you can stay on the ground.

granddaddy always said if you can afford a new tractor, you can afford a new barn to put it in (he owned a stock, mint gnx for two decades). my other granddaddy always said if you can afford the big engine you can afford the gas. (he did grand sports and GTO's)

if gas prices are so big of a concern for what amounts to a toy. people shouldn't be considering any kind of swap in the first place.

same logic applies for forced induction. regardless of current sky prices (that will only rise). if you cant afford to run race gas. don't build a race engine. if you can't afford to run 93. don't build it to need 93.

Gimpster · 04-29-2008, 02:37 PM

Well, my only point is: I'm guessing most of us are "middle class" in here. If any of us had any real amount of money, we wouldn't be dicking with (at best) 13 year old MKII MR2's

I'm sure there are exceptions to that rule, but there you have it.

I make a decent clip, but it doesn't mean I'm going to piss it all away just because I CAN or because it's my TOY. I DD my V6 in the Summer time and as such I require maximum fuel economy & performance. The bulk of us in here arent "fast" anyway in the grand scheme of things, so why not put the most efficient motor you can in to begin with? I'm not sure about all of you, but my income isnt rising with the price of fuel, food and whatever else. So I'd like to plan for the future as much as possible.

I also fly RC (and drive), and yah you're right. However "economy of scale" does apply here

Lets just drop the subject, because obviously none of us will be moved!

Poohhbear9044 · 05-01-2008, 04:09 PM

Think yourself lucky you don't have to pay £5 a gallon ($9) like we do here in the UK

Other than that I chose the 3VZ-FE because the 5VZ is not readily available to us and I am very happy with the choice. I had the heads ported, the valves 3 angle cut and everything benchflowed and it easily revs to the limiter @ 7100 rpm with no drop off in power after 5500rpm as has been suggested. I've yet to have it tested on a rolling road but my butt dyno says 170-190 WHP. Gas mileage is 22mpg if I'm driving it hard and 30mpg if I'm just cruising.

Bob

Gimpster · 05-02-2008, 12:05 AM

Well, I won't be suprised if we're finally paying Europe fuel prices in a couple years.

Dumb question ... do you guys make like 3-4x what we do in salary or what? Maybe you guys just go without buying McMansions etc like Americans tend to do.

NOW I'm really off-topic

Dance_Business · 05-02-2008, 12:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gimpster

Well, I won't be suprised if we're finally paying Europe fuel prices in a couple years.

Dumb question ... do you guys make like 3-4x what we do in salary or what? Maybe you guys just go without buying McMansions etc like Americans tend to do.

NOW I'm really off-topic

But still a great question!

Poohhbear9044 · 05-02-2008, 01:01 AM

Off topic indeed but I will make a quick comment...the average Joe in the UK (operator in a factory for instance) earns an average of £25K ($45k) a year and a small 3 bed semi house costs say £180K ($320K). I'm not sure how that compares to the US.

Bob

Dance_Business · 05-02-2008, 01:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Poohhbear9044

Off topic indeed but I will make a quick comment...the average Joe in the UK (operator in a factory for instance) earns an average of £25K ($45k) a year and a small 3 bed semi house costs say £180K ($320K). I'm not sure how that compares to the US.

Bob

OUCH! We really need to rethink how lucky we are.

TomsMR2 · 05-31-2008, 12:13 AM

jesus, i wish i could buy a 3 bedroom house for 320K! id be ****-my-pants happy!

average household income is like 150K here, and a 3 bedroom house is easily 750K in the older run down neighborhoods. id trade a 9 dollar a gallon gas to buy a 320k 3 bdrm house!

Dance_Business · 05-31-2008, 12:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TomsMR2

jesus, i wish i could buy a 3 bedroom house for 320K! id be ****-my-pants happy!

average household income is like 150K here, and a 3 bedroom house is easily 750K in the older run down neighborhoods. id trade a 9 dollar a gallon gas to buy a 320k 3 bdrm house!

Where are you? Cali or New York

boostd4 · 06-10-2008, 05:46 PM

He lives in one of the few places in this country like that (bay area, CA). If you look up the average 3-bedroom home in the USA, it's definitely less than $300,000.

You do get to choose where you live

... not to say there aren't sacrifices for you choice, but no one FORCES you to live where you are.

Average 3 bedroom house in the near-Chicago suburbs is about $250,000. That's not to say there aren't $750,000 three bedroom houses, because there are... there are also $110,000 three bedroom houses. I'd say $250,000 is the average.

sengk · 06-23-2008, 02:48 PM

I get 20.5mpg on average with a 3vzfe on a s54 tranny.

jdchmiel · 06-27-2008, 02:26 PM

avg salary for a family is mid 50's here. Avg home is 200k. that avg is odd though as there are no houses available in that range, just a ton in the 125-150 range and a ton in the 300-1.5 range.

There is no reason why in an mk2 you should not be able to have 30-35 mpg and 350-400 whp. full EMS will be pretty much required though. You can do it with a internally stock 2zz + a turbo. You can add pistons and up that to 450+ whp on pump gas ( MWR on 93 octane)

View Poll Results: 3VZFE or 5VZFE
3VZFE	82	55.41%
5VZFE	66	44.59%
Voters: 148. You may not vote on this poll

05-31-2008, 12:13 AM	#116 (permalink)
TomsMR2 Still not heraldo. Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Pineapple under the sea Posts: 4,912 Thanks: 18 Thanked 406 Times in 303 Posts Blog Entries: 1 iTrader Rating: (4/100% )	jesus, i wish i could buy a 3 bedroom house for 320K! id be ****-my-pants happy! average household income is like 150K here, and a 3 bedroom house is easily 750K in the older run down neighborhoods. id trade a 9 dollar a gallon gas to buy a 320k 3 bdrm house! __________________ Science fact: If you took all the veins from your body and laid them end to end, you would die.

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Switch to Hybrid Mode Switch to Threaded Mode

03-15-2008, 06:18 AM	#101 (permalink)
ixtlann mr2V06 Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: columbus ohio Posts: 599 Thanks: 9 Thanked 9 Times in 9 Posts iTrader Rating: (0/0% )	Yeah those 5vz z are pretty tuff on gas milage, I wonder how much better the 3vz fe s and 1mzfe s are in that respect

03-27-2008, 10:37 AM	#102 (permalink)
VeilsideMR2 91' N/A BeAsT Join Date: May 2007 Location: Jersey/Boston Posts: 212 Thanks: 3 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post iTrader Rating: (0/0% )	good question...

04-19-2008, 07:34 PM	#103 (permalink)
SnowRocker88 Tech-Nerd Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Greenville, SC Posts: 342 Thanks: 6 Thanked 9 Times in 9 Posts My Google Map iTrader Rating: (1/100% )	I have to say 5VZ-FE seeing as it's factory mapped for 6psi boost and has the TRD charger as a potential, standard bolt-on, option...

04-29-2008, 12:08 AM	#105 (permalink)
Toysrme Cage Fighter Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 681 Thanks: 4 Thanked 23 Times in 17 Posts iTrader Rating: (-1/0% )	can't speak the 5vz in mr2's. i can say that in he camry/es world that all mz blocks get 1mpg average and 2mpg highway better than the 3vz-fe's, and the latest vvt-i's slightly better thn that (but almost none can actually average 30mpg highway. A/T gearing is a hair too high) be the mpg increase from engine tweaks, transmission / torque convertor tweaks, or overall slightly decreasing .cd VS frontal area over time i can't tell ya. not something i would honestly worry about myself. personally i feel if people worry about >5mpg in performance cars they shouldn't consider any swap. grab an old cheap stock NA or a miata or something & stick with 30mpg+.

04-29-2008, 01:10 AM	#106 (permalink)
Gimpster Cage Fighter Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Des Moines, IA Posts: 674 Thanks: 5 Thanked 47 Times in 44 Posts Blog Entries: 2 iTrader Rating: (0/0% )	Couple years ago I'd agree with you, but in a world where gas is $4.00+ per gallon- the mo' MPG the betta. I think we all know this isn't some temporary "spike" like they'd have you believe. It's here to stay. It certainly woke me up. I sold one of my trucks and bought a Yaris liftback.

04-29-2008, 02:08 PM	#108 (permalink)
boostd4 GT28RS 350whp or bust! Join Date: May 2005 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 303 Thanks: 1 Thanked 6 Times in 6 Posts iTrader Rating: (4/100% )	So there is a P&P EMS by Hydra for the 5VZ right? If that's the case, gas mileage really shouldn't be an issue. With a wideband and some time I'm sure you could tune part throttle cruising to get 25mpg+... I'd bet your mixed results would still be above 20mpg.

04-29-2008, 02:28 PM	#109 (permalink)
Toysrme Cage Fighter Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 681 Thanks: 4 Thanked 23 Times in 17 Posts iTrader Rating: (-1/0% )	my only point was that gas is a small price to pay for nothing but a toy. we never use our F150(and its a horrible vehicle), or lexus because of gas. Only when when we MUST have the bed. otherwise it's all 88-89 civic hatch here for a daily. The F150 is a once a day, every other week thing until we need it. The lexus is my date car, and the civic is the daily driver... 40-70mpg (pulse and glide owns) beats 20mpg tops for the lexus, beats 17mpg average on the truck. shoot, 8 years ago as a teenager when I was flying my first IMAA scale R/C plane 30% nitro-methanol was $13/g for it and i was burning a 1/4 gallon every 15-20min of flying. but its a toy. you can either suck it up and fly, or you can stay on the ground. granddaddy always said if you can afford a new tractor, you can afford a new barn to put it in (he owned a stock, mint gnx for two decades). my other granddaddy always said if you can afford the big engine you can afford the gas. (he did grand sports and GTO's) if gas prices are so big of a concern for what amounts to a toy. people shouldn't be considering any kind of swap in the first place. same logic applies for forced induction. regardless of current sky prices (that will only rise). if you cant afford to run race gas. don't build a race engine. if you can't afford to run 93. don't build it to need 93.

04-29-2008, 02:37 PM	#110 (permalink)
Gimpster Cage Fighter Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Des Moines, IA Posts: 674 Thanks: 5 Thanked 47 Times in 44 Posts Blog Entries: 2 iTrader Rating: (0/0% )	Well, my only point is: I'm guessing most of us are "middle class" in here. If any of us had any real amount of money, we wouldn't be dicking with (at best) 13 year old MKII MR2's I'm sure there are exceptions to that rule, but there you have it. I make a decent clip, but it doesn't mean I'm going to piss it all away just because I CAN or because it's my TOY. I DD my V6 in the Summer time and as such I require maximum fuel economy & performance. The bulk of us in here arent "fast" anyway in the grand scheme of things, so why not put the most efficient motor you can in to begin with? I'm not sure about all of you, but my income isnt rising with the price of fuel, food and whatever else. So I'd like to plan for the future as much as possible. I also fly RC (and drive), and yah you're right. However "economy of scale" does apply here Lets just drop the subject, because obviously none of us will be moved!

05-01-2008, 04:09 PM	#111 (permalink)
Poohhbear9044 Some Skills Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: United Kingdom Posts: 79 Thanks: 2 Thanked 19 Times in 10 Posts iTrader Rating: (0/0% )	Think yourself lucky you don't have to pay £5 a gallon ($9) like we do here in the UK Other than that I chose the 3VZ-FE because the 5VZ is not readily available to us and I am very happy with the choice. I had the heads ported, the valves 3 angle cut and everything benchflowed and it easily revs to the limiter @ 7100 rpm with no drop off in power after 5500rpm as has been suggested. I've yet to have it tested on a rolling road but my butt dyno says 170-190 WHP. Gas mileage is 22mpg if I'm driving it hard and 30mpg if I'm just cruising. Bob

05-02-2008, 12:05 AM	#112 (permalink)
Gimpster Cage Fighter Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Des Moines, IA Posts: 674 Thanks: 5 Thanked 47 Times in 44 Posts Blog Entries: 2 iTrader Rating: (0/0% )	Well, I won't be suprised if we're finally paying Europe fuel prices in a couple years. Dumb question ... do you guys make like 3-4x what we do in salary or what? Maybe you guys just go without buying McMansions etc like Americans tend to do. NOW I'm really off-topic

05-02-2008, 01:01 AM	#114 (permalink)
Poohhbear9044 Some Skills Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: United Kingdom Posts: 79 Thanks: 2 Thanked 19 Times in 10 Posts iTrader Rating: (0/0% )	Off topic indeed but I will make a quick comment...the average Joe in the UK (operator in a factory for instance) earns an average of £25K ($45k) a year and a small 3 bed semi house costs say £180K ($320K). I'm not sure how that compares to the US. Bob

06-10-2008, 05:46 PM	#118 (permalink)
boostd4 GT28RS 350whp or bust! Join Date: May 2005 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 303 Thanks: 1 Thanked 6 Times in 6 Posts iTrader Rating: (4/100% )	He lives in one of the few places in this country like that (bay area, CA). If you look up the average 3-bedroom home in the USA, it's definitely less than $300,000. You do get to choose where you live ... not to say there aren't sacrifices for you choice, but no one FORCES you to live where you are. Average 3 bedroom house in the near-Chicago suburbs is about $250,000. That's not to say there aren't $750,000 three bedroom houses, because there are... there are also $110,000 three bedroom houses. I'd say $250,000 is the average.

06-23-2008, 02:48 PM	#119 (permalink)
sengk No Skills Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 153 Thanks: 3 Thanked 12 Times in 3 Posts iTrader Rating: (1/100% )	I get 20.5mpg on average with a 3vzfe on a s54 tranny.

06-27-2008, 02:26 PM	#120 (permalink)
jdchmiel No Skills Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: raleigh nc Posts: 287 Thanks: 4 Thanked 5 Times in 5 Posts iTrader Rating: (1/100% )	avg salary for a family is mid 50's here. Avg home is 200k. that avg is odd though as there are no houses available in that range, just a ton in the 125-150 range and a ton in the 300-1.5 range. There is no reason why in an mk2 you should not be able to have 30-35 mpg and 350-400 whp. full EMS will be pretty much required though. You can do it with a internally stock 2zz + a turbo. You can add pistons and up that to 450+ whp on pump gas ( MWR on 93 octane)